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How does unemployment matter for refinance?

Profile picture for bengtc
Contributions: 12
Hi,
After 25 years in the hightech industry, I became unemployed for the time in my life. I now want to refinance my Jumbo 5/1 ARM (3.875%) that converts to fixed in three months with a +3% bump, but a broker I spoke with said being unemployed would be a "big problem" to getting a new loan.
My FICO is 820. I have $3M in savings. LTV according to Zillow is 65%. Loan amount is $520,000.
My wife has a FICO of 730, but only makes $40K, less than our current expenses.
I hope to find a job soon, but after one month of job-seeking, things are not looking great...
Advice?
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January 07 - Sunnyvale

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Profile picture for patrick ignacio
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Unfortunately, unemployment brings up a major issue.  Some form of employment and verifiable income is required these days. 

A few years ago, we had the luxury of no income verification and no employment loans, but those days are gone. 

The day you start working is the day you become eligible again for refinance. 
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January 07
Profile picture for CA UMB
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Ben, you spoke with a broker that has not been exposed to your situation and apparently, didn't wish to explore it.

You are in fantastic shape to get a refinance, with $3M in savings and somewhere around 65% LTV!

Fannie/Freddie guidelines allow someone with no visable source of income to be approved for a loan as long as they can document that they have the liquidity for the first 36 months of PITI (Principle, Interest, Taxes and Insurance). .... Good luck!
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January 07
Profile picture for bengtc
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Rudi,
If I could show liquidity, would I be offered a good rate? Or slapped with a +2% "risk bonus."

Thx.
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January 07
Profile picture for Colorado Mtg Broker
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No job, no loan.
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January 07
Profile picture for 203K Specialist
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How about a little more info Rudi....I have never heard that guideline before...
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January 07
Profile picture for Steve Jacobson
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Ben, I read your question and the replies thus far. Your loan balance is $520k that is above the conforming loan limit of $417k so a jumbo loan would be needed above $417k. Here's an idea, you have 3M in savings that you most likely receive interest income. Perhaps you could use interest income shown on Schedule B for the last 3 years and average the result for monthly qualifying income plus your wife's current salary. Perhaps your household income would be adequate to qualify without current employment/income. I recommend researching this option. Sum your Schedule B interest income for the last 3 years and divide by 36. If you have adequate income, try this method for approval. Pay down the current loan to the conforming limit or an amount you may qualify for at closing. I hope this helps. Best, Steve Jacobson, Mortgage Market of Florida
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January 07
Profile picture for brtlmj
With $3M in savings, why do you want to refinance? Just pay the mortgage off...
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January 07
Profile picture for Michael Dorr
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I believe the Santa Clara County is still at 625 on conforming-Who is your portfollio of 3M with, Call them, see what's up. Paying off you mortgage with such a great deal of liquidity is poor use of arbitrage. I can give you name of a friend in Petaluma(SP) Close enough to you.

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January 07
Profile picture for Lew Corcoran
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Bottom line is: No job, no loan for you. Your unemployment income would most likely be insufficient to support a mortgage payment obligation, and there's no certainty of it continuing after 6 months.

Once you find a wage paying job, you'll be able to to apply for a mortgage assuming of course your income, credit and capacity to repay the loan is there.

Don't be too concerned about losing out on these low rates. Chances are, you'll find employment before rates do go back up for good. That in and of itself should be incentive enough for you to find a job quickly. Good luck.
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January 07
Profile picture for Georgia Loans
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I have a lender that does what Rudi is describing but they do not lend out of the southeast. They use a very liquid asset like CD's, divide the asset by 36 months and that becomes their income, a self paying annuity. Then he still has a ton of reserves, killer credit, low ltv, DONE.

bengtc, start with your current lender and ask for it, based on your assets.

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January 07

Ben, Relax, look at your note.

3% would be the margin.  3% was extremely high and you will see a huge premium paid by you at for the origination on the settlement statement.  That is water under the bridge. Live and learn. Normal rates where 1.50 -2.25%.

Having said that, Jumbos where mostly Libor based, if lucky T.bill based.  One year libor is about 1.23 and T,Bill about .87.  So your BUMP would be 3% plus 1.23 or about 4.25% on your adjustable.

Hold on to that.  Adjustable loans are as good as gold.  No one can get one these days.  I have clients calling me and shocked at their 3.125 0 3.25% current rates.  Odds they will go lower.

On your you are probably floored at your start rate. I made most at 1% so they could go lower.  Most adjustable notes have a floor at their start rate.

Be happy and hold on to that mortgage.  : )

3.875% is pretty good.

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January 07
Profile picture for bengtc
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Jamie,

Just double-checked ; I'm on Libor and my bump is 2.25%, not 3% as I thought.
So with 1.23+2.25 = 3.48%, not bad....
I'll hang onto my adjustable.

Barring the uncertainty of skyrocketing interest triggered by a dollar collapse. But that's another story.
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January 08
Profile picture for greg12311
What do retired people do for loans? I got a mortgage with no job, a solid FICO of 820, no debt, and investments that would cover the entire loan if needed. I got an excellent rate for a fixed, 15 year mortgage at 5.3%. This was 11 months ago.
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January 08
Profile picture for CA UMB
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Greg, start your own thread. This one is for Ben. .... Thank you!
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January 08
Profile picture for Georgia Loans
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bengtc, the 1 yr libor is just over 2.00. It has not been below 2 since 2004. Still, with your margin of 2.25 that = 4.25%. You mentioned it converts to a fixed in 3 months. It does not convert to a fixed, it converts to a 1 year arm so when it does convert, the 1 year libor will have probably moved down a little more maybe giving you a 4% rate. That rate is only fixed for 1 year, until the next adjustment 1 year later. If you plan on staying in this home more than 2 years, I would look into a lender that will underwrite your file using some of your most liquid assets.
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January 08
Profile picture for Sam Shueh
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Have you considered paying it off from your savings to solve your misery? You can only demonstrate a 40K income. Banks are not unlikely to risk this kind of A/P for a 520K. May be you can negotiate a hardship which will quickly lower your 820 FICO score to something you don't want to accept.

Many retirees have solid pension and other incomes. They have no problem getting a small mortgage.

In high tech industry with as many years of experience as you have, I tend to think Silicon Valley use less (<25 years) experienced employees for lower pay. There used to a saying for every $10K one wants it would take a month to find that job. This is not the blog for career counseling. You need to have some professional help you to assess how marketable you . Is interest or tax write off important if you have no income? Good luck to you.  
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January 09
Profile picture for Pasadenan
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With most investments doing as poorly as they are, and with no taxable income, I really don't see why one wouldn't want to use savings to pay off the loan; that is a "return" of at least 3.88%, annual and no loan initiation fees...

But if it is pre-tax dollar retirement funds; that may be a different issue.  But you can borrow on your own funds, financing your own loan, and continuing to make payments, or you can use your own funds as "collateral" for someone else to finance you, or as suggested, your adjustable rate is still a good rate, so why give it up?  If you don't have the income to make the payments, you could always draw on the savings to make the payments.

Personally, if it is not retirement funds and not in an account bearing over 4% annual interest, I would just pay off the loan.  And if it is a retirement account with pre-tax dollars, I would just keep the loan I had.

And if you are close to retirement age, I would just retire early, but not start drawing on Social Security until after 70.  Then maybe start another business on the side.


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January 09
Profile picture for CA UMB
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Ben, great rates. Just as if you were employed.
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January 09
Profile picture for tchau_99
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with $3M savings, it is silly to try to get a loan.....

Just pay it off!!!!!

You will save plenty of interest $$$$$ (>$25,000) per year.  This is now your salary instead.

Hope this is helpful
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January 09
 

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