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Yes, that 4 letter word says it all. You see, the voter fraud is only a percentage of the total votes and has more power with less of 'the people' voting. Let's do the math.
5,000 fraudulent votes with 50,000 real votes is a lot at 10% sway. (5 / 50 = .10)
5,000 fraudulent votes with 500,000 real votes is now only 1% sway. (5 / 500 = .01)
So, I urge every single person that reads this to VOTE. Do the 4 letter
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Do the 4 letter word! Don't think your vote doesn't count! Every vote counts to erase voter fraud! Help 'the people' by voting.
... By the way, ignore the drabble in this thread of people saying to vote one way or another during this election. You are Zillow people and have a solid head of your own. As Perot said, "Vote your concience." He may not have won, but he did hold 19% of votes, which will definitely sway the voting system away from having any impact on fraudulent voting practices.
Make "the people's" count by voting!
I'm not here to debate all the tinfoil hat voter fraud stuff, just here to say that if you think both parties are corrupt and evil, that is no excuse not to vote. Vote for any 3rd party (even if they really suck, it will still send a message) or just write someone in.
Until people stop voting the lesser evil, our only two choices will be evil.
Vote early and often!!!
sadly MTV has corrupted the voting process...how many who vote actually even know
what the constitution is ?
if you do vote get freaking educated!
Space lives in an electrolux!!
sadly MTV has corrupted the voting process
I'm curious, how'd they managed that?
Wasn't just MTV; also elementary school, CBS, NBC, ABC, PBS,...
As anyone that has observed any advertising knows, propaganda is very effective at controlling others. As they say; follow the money.
Of course one should vote if eligable, even though it means manditory Jury service. You also get manditory Jury service for driving a car.
And don't write someone in that has not been prequalified; the count will just show that as a "not voted"; which doesn't count for or against any of the candidates. For President, choose and of the other 4 on the ballot; hopefully one that comes closer to your ideology on at least of few of the issues.
But don't just stop at voting; to help eliminate fraud, be observant of what occurs, and report all potential fraud activity to be investigated. If poll workers don't know the rules regarding provisional ballots, or absentee ballots at the polls; inform the poll workers of the correct procedures, and then still report them anyway. If they didn't know the rules, than there are a lot of other poll workers that didn't get sufficient training either.
choose and of ---> choose *any* of
also 90% of voter fraud takes advantage of loopholes in registration policies, if you vote, then you know that at least you arent a part of the problem...
I completely agree with space_acer. Too many votes are cast without consideration of the issues by too many people who do not even know what the candidates are saying or how much of it is simply said to get their vote.
Speaking of Voter Fraud
I can't believe the majority of the mass media aren't looking into the Acorn situation with all their energy and resources.
I'm an independent, and truly won't be deciding how I vote until the last words are spokn by the candidates, and it is time to go to the polls.
Enough information regarding the Acorn voter fraud question has surfaced that it should be of huge concern to everyone. The low profile regarding the question that the majority of the mass media has / is taking really upsets me, and should you too.
Like getting a driver's license to show that one has the minimun qualifications to be on the road and endanger out lives, what would be so bad about a minimum passing grade on a basic voter eligibility test; for ideas, maybe some very basic civics questions.
Why do some people object to a requirement of showing some legitimate form of positive ID when checking in at the voting stations?
The right to vote is just that. It is the most important right we have as U.S. citizens.
What's wrong with that right mandating the very small responsibility of needing to secure whatever form of ID is acceptable in one's area (there can be many different types of ID's, so any legitimate voter can get something), and having to present it when voting.
Ever heard of Mark Jacoby? Nathan Sproul? Young Political Majors? Honestly, you don't seem at all undecided. But is any of it even truly relevant? Do you know how many charges of election fraud have been filed in the last 25 or 30 years? If you're really concerned then just build and use the device below.
Regarding IDs, it's not at all simple, there's a real level of complexity involved when you try to implement anything that potentially inhibits a fundamental right. And histroically we've had many, many more problems with laws, rules and regulations being used to influence and restrict who is able to vote as opposed to actual voter fraud.
If you don't have ID and you don't pay taxes you should not be allowed to vote. The people who foot the bill should be making the decisions in this country. My "right" to vote can be negated by lax laws which encourage fraud and abuse.
And don't write someone in that has not been prequalified; the count will just show that as a "not voted"; which doesn't count for or against any of the candidates.
Really? Weird how we end up with vote totals for them, then. 37,240 in 2004.
It'sa tough balance. There are a lot of insane/stupid people who have strong opinions on the issues and vote in alrge numbers, so we need at least some amount of apathetic/stupid voters to dilute them. It would be nice if we had a greater pool of non-stupid voters, but that's just a dream.
I'm sure that if anyone comes up with any actual accusations of voter fraud, the media will cover it. Currently there is nothing other than the fact that paying people by the hour to get forms filled out causes them to fill out lots of forms.
Because no one can be trusted to write or administer the test. If you doubt this, you haven't been paying attention.
Because it would be used to deny legitimate voters their rights. While there is a chance that it might also prevent a few cases of fraud, no one in their right mind would say that the fraud prevented woudl be as large as the legitimate votes prevented. And that's if you consider a 1:1 ratio to be "worth it."
Pitt? Any smuggler KNOWS some of his 'merchandise' will get scooped up by the authorities, but he does it any. Why? Because he KNOWS most gets through and it's worth the risk. Acorn MUST have a way to turn the voter registrations into VOTES, or they wouldn't risk it.
Plus, if they can't turn it into votes, they wouldn't be prosecuting Acorn in so MANY states. The laws are there to protect the voting system from fraud.
Lastly, although a voter id SOUNDS good, no id could be REASONABLY required for mail in votes.
Any smuggler KNOWS some of his 'merchandise' will get scooped up by the authorities, but he does it any. Why? Because he KNOWS most gets through and it's worth the risk.
And in this case, you're saying the smuggler has a giant crate labeled "SMUGGLED GOODS" in plain sight. I am suggesting that if they were smuggling, this would not be the way to go about doing it.
Acorn MUST have a way to turn the voter registrations into VOTES, or they wouldn't risk it.
Only if you think that they are trying to get fraudulent votes. I have seen no evidence that suggest anything other than the obvious result of having people get paid for registering voters. I have no problem with making that illegal.
So far as I know, they are being prosecuted in NO states. They are being investedated in about a dozen. In most states, they are required to turn in any form they get, whether it's mine or Mickey Mouse's. The alternative is that they can throw out anything "suspicious," which is not something that a 3rd party should have the power to do.
There is a list of everyone who votes in every election. It will be very easy to prove fraud if a bunch of people are shown to have voted when they didn't. The fact that this isn't going to happen won't prevent my friend who insists that McCain would be winning in a landslide without ACORN (who apparently screws with polling as well, somehow) from screaming fraud if his guy loses.
BMF - I have read your posts and you are smarter then that! "I have seen no evidence that suggest anything other than the obvious result of having people get paid for registering voters"
I know you can't really be that nieve and believe what you are saying. ACORN wants Obama to win. At all cost. The Dems feel they were cheated (rightfully so) in the last election and now feel entitled to the white house. They are going to take it by any means necessary. Fake voter registration which will eventually lead to voter fraud, a corrupt media which is equivalent to the Dem's having an unlimited amount of campaign financing for advertising, pure lies and the promotion of class warefare. Put the kool aid down! I know it is the popular drink these days but it is affecting your judgement.
zill- are you a lurker? And anyway- explain to BMF, and me for that matter, how faking voter registrations can turn into faking actual VOTES. You were need a concerted effort with straw voters, poll volunteers, town clerks!- you name it. I just don't see it happening. But then again, wasn't there a town in PA with like 3000 votes for Bush when they only had 500 people registered to vote (or something obscene like that). I guess anything's possible.
BMF- your friend really thinks McCain should be winning huh? Damn.
Acorn will be the subject of a strict Settlement and Compliance agreement, designed to ensure that this type of negligent supervision does not occur again. ACORN has also agreed to pay King County $25,000 in compensation for the time and effort it took to clean up our voter rolls of these false registrations. (Prosecuted 7 Acorn Employees)
Oct 29th, 2003 two Acorn workers plead guilty to voter fraud.
Aug 4th, 2006 One Acorn worker plead guilty.
So let's just look at 2007, there were too many hits to list it all...
June 23rd, MO Four plead guilty
Feb 6th, MO, One plead guilty
May 18th, MO Two plead guilty, two later convicted
Oct 29th, WA 3 of 7 plead guilty (biggest case in state history)
Aug 9th, CA One plead guilty
Jenn - I will assume that was a rhetorical question since you seem to have found an example of the answer on your own. I like your train of thought when accussed of cheating. "Hey, they did it first" I guess that makes it ok!
I'm tired of posting! lol
Honestly, it's a pretty easy job, and really shouldn't have these cases UNLESS Acorn is not providing proper guidance... or don't care to. We've all seen enough corruption in companies to know that 'chit rolls downhill'.
Put the kool aid down!
So you can drink some more? I think you've had enough...
I've found that those on the far right (and far left, too - I just don't know any of those personally) can convince themselves to believe and/or rationalize anything.
Debts - So that was just a list of dates and numbers, but I assume that if there were links they would all say something like "Some guy who was being paid by the hour to create voter registration forms filed a whole ton of them with fake names." That is a summary of every article I've read about the matter.
Can you explain why, if they intended to engage in massive voter fraud, would they choose to involve so many people and so many obviously fake names? It's the exact opposite of the behavior I would expect to see of a group that wanted to perpetrate voter fraud. Occam's Razor.
You guys know they tried to funnell 20% of the bailout package to Acorn right?
BMF- I registered to vote as 'McLovin' and they bought it! Yeah! Now when I show up at the polls with my fake ID, I can vote as McLovin. Dude, I am so smart.
Debts- what did they plead guilty to? and what does any of this have to do with election day????? I still don't get it.
Honestly, you don't seem at all undecided.
How can you "honestly" make that judgement?
But is any of it even truly relevant? Do you know how many charges of election fraud have been filed in the last 25 or 30 years? If you're really concerned then just build and use the device below.
I don't have a clue what that drawing ("device") was all about. It appeared to be some form of aggression being expessed on your part. Were you getting angry and acting out? Please tell me you weren't.
Regarding IDs, it's not at all simple
Many things worthwhile aren't simple. I still see nothing wrong with a system that requires its voters to have some form of positive identification for voting purposes. Do you really believe if a person truly values his/her right to vote, and understands well in advance that there is an ID requirement they will have to adhere to, they won't go throught the proper channels to meet the requirement? I don't think that is asking too much. It may take effort, but some form of ID(s) system can be established so that all voters can get an legitimate, acceptable voter ID.
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