OBAMA NATION = ABOMINATION!

[content removed by moderator for being a personal insult]

Luanne:

You may want to get yur feet wet posting more relevant topics in other forums. This isn't the "please start a political debate" string (although sometimes they evolve/devolve to that). It hurts your credibility to post carelessly until others in the forum don't think your an ass.

Luanne,

What is the matter?  Did you not get this week's RNC talking points?  You should have gotten it in your inbox on Monday.  Fannie and Freddie are old news.  This week is Bill Ayers.

Oh, and just a little FYI: McCain's campaign chairman Rick Davis is a former Fannie Mae lobbyist.

(Not t

I

Zillow hiccup…

(not that I ever advocate careless posting, but we all have our moments)

      After hearing Obama and Mc Cain point fingers at each other over lobbyists and scam artists in their campaigns I think the best campaign artists are scam artists. They both are riddled with them in one capacity or another. The financial meltdown has nothing to do with Bushie anymore. He has been a lame duck for 6 months. Who knows if its because of Obama or Mc Cain .

     Probably both or neither but I think its because Bernanke and Paulson hid their heads in the sand until it was way too late. What I think is the dumbest thing of all is that they were in such a damn hurry to pass the 750 billion package and then dumped half a trillion into the system and cut rates and it did nothing in the slightest.

    I think Bernanke and Paulson coming out to tell everyone we are in a crisis has caused everyone to freak out creating the disaster they were hoping to fix.

the more you try to generate out of the differences between the two, the less i think of your point... since both are lying to you

Ok this thread freaked me out. I swear I was driving on the highway about an hour ago and "Obamanation" popped in my head. thinking of it as the countless followers of Obama that have absolutely committed to voting and supporting him but cant give a single reason other than " I like what he has to say" when questioned and asked to elaborate on which of Obama’s views they agree most with and why, they seem to draw a blank. I'm not saying all are like this but there does seem to be a large number of people that are blindly following him. These people are the "Obamanation"

Apparently my brain has accepted a direct RSS from Zillow.

     I was a huge Obama fan until I got used to the great speeches and figured out he actually was never saying anything. Now that the economy has crashed, he doesnt even have the money to do 1/4 of the things he promised so how the heck does he hope to solve anything?  I want to believe Obama that he will lead us to a new era, but he never convinced me HOW he could deliver where nobody else can.

"Meanwhile, over 100 top economists endorse McCain's economic plan."

Which one?  The one he announced the other night when he said he'd use our taxdollars to pay for deadbeats' mortgages?

Next week Acorn should be in full force and Ayer out. lol

     It will cost more to .........let em all rot.......... Klarek . The lender will absorb more losses to foreclosure and no doubt have the government bail them out for that as well. Why don't people get this? If you are a realist, how come you don't understand this? Foreclosure is a LAST STRAW by the lender and is sorely ineffective at  recovering losses. Lets have a 5 year backlog in inventory? 

      You don't want your 'tax dollars' going to these 'deadbeats' but you want MORE tax dollars going to the 'deadbeat lender' instead? Meanwhile the 'deadbeat' borrower lives in the house free for a year to 2 years then rents for 3 years and buys another house. We sure showed those deadbeats !

No it will not cost more to let them foreclose.  McCain wants to pay the difference between what they owe and what the houses are worth (or what they can afford).  If they foreclose and the house goes on the market, that's how much will be lost anyway (assuming we're covering the banks' liquidity concerns).  So the question is this: do we fully cover the banks' losses on these assets by essentially giving hundreds of thousands of dollars per person to the most irresponsible people that helped create this mess?  F*ck no!

So yes, I'd rather our taxdollars go to the banks.

....no it will not cost more to let them foreclose..........

When you start writing stuff like this, I don't know what to tell you. 

....so yes  Id rather our tax dollars go to the banks............

     You want the tax dollars to go to the banks who created these idiot products ? That's like saying you want all the drug addicts to be hung out to dry but the drug DEALERS get a free pass. 

     I want our tax dollars to go to solving the housing crisis. Letting em all rot is the dumbest move we are going to make. It will cost far more in the long run.

     Did you know that guys can walk away from their house, and with the backlog of inventory they will long be out of bankruptcy or foreclosure to the point where they will start buying back their own houses? How do you plan to GET RID of all this inventory? Unless they loosen the guidelines they will NEVER get rid of the inventory for 5 years.

 .....letting them all rot .......... does NOT punish them at all. It actually lets them off the hook . They get 1 to 2 years free rent then wait 3 years to go do it all over again. Yippee!!!!!

"You want the tax dollars to go to the banks who created these idiot products ? That's like saying you want all the drug addicts to be hung out to dry but the drug DEALERS get a free pass."

A lot of people created this mess.  How about the people taking out loans at ten times their income?  LYING about their income?  How about Congress which pushed for loans for high-risk borrowers?  How about the brokers who bartered crappy loans to these banks?

"I want our tax dollars to go to solving the housing crisis."

How do you want to "solve" it?  Bring prices back up to unsustainable artificial levels?

"Did you know that guys can walk away from their house, and with the backlog of inventory they will long be out of bankruptcy or foreclosure to the point where they will start buying back their own houses?"

No, they'll go rent for cheap, and learn their lessons.  The houses can be sold to responsible people who aren't getting in over their heads. 

".....letting them all rot .......... does NOT punish them at all. It actually lets them off the hook ."

Yes, it's a good deal for them.  In fact, the difference between my position and yours is that I don't think they deserve those houses and never did.  If our tax dollars are paying the difference between what they owe and what the house is worth, I'd rather they not stay there.  Let somebody who DIDN'T screw us get to have the cheaper mortgage.

I agree with Klarek and I am not happy with either candidate's "solution" for the RE mess.

Vote for stalin er palin at your own risk. (you have been warned)

Rachel, I agree Obama appears that way, but he doesn't seem to make decisions. I can listen till I'm blue in the face and nothing would get done if I did that. Although, then I COULD say that everyone else's decisions are bad and not take any blame. This is not something I expect from a Pres. My final straw was him being a lawyer for Acorn. He CAN'T fight that corruption because he's bound by law to not do a conflict of interest. It's a palin waiting to happen. If she spoke against the bro in law, it was a misuse of her office. If he tries to go after Acorn, it would then be a misuse of his confidenciality.

Klarek. You claim you are a realist when in fact you are acting like a moralist.

     It is irrelivant that you think they didnt deserve the house. The bank DID. The bank was the bottom line. They put them past underwriting under their own criteria and gave them the money. Does that mean they deserve to get a free ride now? No. But neither does the  lender.

      The MORAL reality is they should all be foreclosed on for not being able to make their payment. The MORAL reality is that the lenders should just go under. AIG should go under.  Fannie Freddie. Right? Not. They got BAILED OUT.

      The REALIST position that its worse for the housing market and they get a free ride anyways.

      The reason I want them to stay in their house has nothing to do with me wanting them to have a free ride. I already stipulated that long ago , but you dont want to read it or you ignore it. I have figured out that while some actually deserve a break, most dont.

     The REALITY is that they will ALL get a free ride whether they get booted out or not. And this reality is something you are not willing to accept.

      It therefore all comes down to WHICH FREE RIDE you want them to get. Its obvious to me that re writing the mortgages and keeping them in the house is far better than trying to scrounge around finding new borrowers under ever tightening guidelines to buy them all up. We would be looking at a 5 year backlog.

     Im not for Mc Cains plan of buying them all at face value , but I am for forcing the lender to take a loss and the goverment chipping in some to make it worth their while is the best thing to do and help clear up the inventory which helps our economy.

     This notion that prices will stay INFLATED is based on WHAT? That has to come from the lenders offering idiot products again, which they will never be able to do again because nobody will buy them. These re writes do not count as sales and have nothing to do with housing prices. The prices can only be maintained if the lending criteria supports them. We all know it wont.

I was depressed last night thinking about Obama and Biden, so I called Lifeline.


Got a freakin' call center in Pakistan .
I told them I was suicidal.
They got all excited and asked if I could drive a truck.

roflmao Denver!!

Neither have a plan the will give a lot of confidence because neither are financial/mortgage/RE/leverage geniuses.  Add to that an unprecedented housing. credit and leverage disaster along with rising unemployment and it is not really possible for the GOV to solve this, regardless of choice. Why does the "private sector" and the quasi-private sector make this mess and the GOV and the 2 potential candidates have to solve it?  HANK told us last FEB/MAR 2007 that the entire mess (subprime only) was $120 - $150 billion...  BEN and HANK have bee working on this solution for 18 months.  It will not be solved by the US government.  It may be helped, but it will be solved by the public.  We have to solve our own problems. Nothing against JM, but "negotiating" new payments and terms by "buying" all the bad mortgages.. (currently over 4million are over 30 days behind) is much grander than anything thought of.  Lowering rates and balances for "higher risk" borrowers does not make any economic sense.  There will be a massive outpouring to get in that line and not pay..  If the FED wants to solve it... they need to insure the ones that have paid and can pay will pay... Like the thoughts of injecting capital into BANKS that will survive.  This is housing triage.. save the ones that will survive...deal with the others in an orderly way (foreclosure) and resell (at a loss yes) to someone able and willing to pay.  It is not that hard.. It is very expensive, but not that hard.

      The idea of buying up all the mortgages will never happen. There is already a qualifying process. No Doc and Stated will be thrown out unless they want to show income tax forms backdated to the original loan proving they could afford it. 

   Re writing the mortgages is only for folks who qualified for the original loan and can now still pay the loan . That's not a lot of borrowers. The real key is to stop the guy who could pay if he stressed out  from dumping the place because he is 150k underneath and its worth it to bankrupt to save the $150k and his quality of life. Its also for folks who qualified but now have a job loss or other unforeseen folly who cant pay the original but can now pay the lowered mortgage.

   All I ever hear is that they wanna 'bailout the deadbeats' , ignoring the fact there is strict criteria to qualify for this in the first place. No 'deadbeat' will ever qualify. I have also come to the conclusion that they want them all to rot so that there is a further backlog and the prices of housing will become so ultra depressed they get their 500k house for 80 grand . They want it all to tank so they can swoop in for the kill and score an undervalued house.

   However, there is already a first wave of folks who walked away last year and they are now one year out of bankruptcy or foreclosure or short sale. Within 2 years these first wavers will now be able to score the same 500k house for 80 grand, which I don't think these guys have considered.

Deadbeats will not qualify for HOPE because debt ratio and numerous other "pork-filled" requirements will kill most even if the LENDERS agreed to the terms (another animal) It's not that the idea is bad.. it is that it has so many layers.  It is really tougher than getting the loan to begin with...  Make sure the ones that can swim do not drown... Sorry for those that skipped the free lesson offered at the local YMCA, but when the Titanic goes down, there will be many casualties, but many survivors.  We hear about the "exceptions" of the 1 million + in stress.. and now that story is getting old and pushed under the WS debacle.  We'll have plenty of time to Monday Morning Mortgageback for months and possibly years to come.