Profile picture for adosweet

Speaking of ' Bad Agents'...............?

What options does a buyer; with or without any particular ' buyers-agent ', have, when a property they're MORE than interested in, is listed with an agent(cy), where there's a DEFINITE conflict of interest, both personal and proffessional?
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April 03 2012 - Gillette
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Naturally, agents are going to recommend you get a buyer's agent. And they're right. It's one of the main benefits of agency: you don't have to deal with the chaos that can often be associated with the negotiations and contingency periods.

A client recently contacted me to do exactly what you are asking for. They found the house, but despised, with passion, the agent who was selling the property. The entire negotiation, and 6 weeks of contract time was full of annoying to borderline harassing calls from the agent. I later found out that even the seller couldn't stand their agent. And you know what? The buyer didn't have to deal with one drop of it.

You should also know that an agent is required to present all offers to their client. If you suspect that they didn't, find the owner, and if the owner validates it, you could get the agent fined, if not suspended from practice.
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April 03 2012
Profile picture for Pasadenan
Complain?  What did you find me "complaining" about in my last 300 posts?

I have no complaints.  All is good!

"I spoke from the heart" -

Oh?  That is not what you posted, you posted that your comment was intentionally "facetious" and asked if we all couldn't have figured that out by now, since you've been posting on the site since yesterday.

You really don't think those statements you made were "NAR talking points"?  Would you like me to post links to the thousands of times those statements have been made on this website?  It should only take 10 minutes to generate the list.  Personally, I think it would be a waste of time as it just says the same thing over and over, and has been that way since summer 2007 and people wouldn't bother to open all those links to read them anyway.

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April 04 2012
"Not to mention, you wouldn't just be repeating misleading NAR propaganda talking points".

And to you  Pasadenan ....Sorry to dissappoint you buy I am not one to have time to sit around like you and read what you may call propaganda.  I just happen on this site today.  Don't know if I will be back again because of bitter people like you.  I spoke from the heart, if you would like a personal list of my previous clients (with their permission of course) I would love to provide you for their input on my work with them.  In my 6th year with over half my business from referrals alone and number one seller in the number one office in our association allows me to be proud of doing an honest days work.  And...believing in Realtors "make the difference" slogan or whatever it may be. 
I Went back and read some of your other posts...Sounds like to me ....all you do is Complain, Acuse, and Whine.  Good luck with that.  Either you have been screwed over by someone prior in life or you are a major scheme artist yourself and believe everyone else is the same.
Either way...move on...for the sake of the good folk on here!
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April 04 2012
Best of luck! Honestly I feel that I have learned more on how to do better from the bad experiences than the good ones. Doesn't mean I wish bad experiences on you. I don't. But if you get licensed you will remember what this whole mess gel. Like and it will shape how you serve people. This job can be (and should be in my opinion ) a lot more about serving people than about "selling". That attitude isn't likely to ever win me a 5mil production plaque but that's ok with me
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April 04 2012
Good Luck on your license.  Now that you got live a bad experience will give you a little insight of many others without an agent.  You will finally get to here how many customers express that they will never buy another 'for sale by owner' home without an agent because of being screwed or paying too much, or just plain simple mistakes they made.  You too will see why your new profession becomes so valuable and how it seems like every transaction can be different.  You too will defend the job of agents like yourself when you see the difference your expertise made helping another buy a home.  You will feel the joy when you know your knowledge kept your client out of the tank, knowing full well on some of the most complicated transactions could have had disastrous outcomes  if not for your expertise and early judgement.  Adosweet, I hope you get to really find why agents will always recommend agents when you become a good agent yourself.  I love my job and now respect what agents know and what they do after I became one 6 yrs ago. 

Again ...Good Luck.
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April 04 2012
Profile picture for Pasadenan
"A good buyers agent will look out for YOUR BEST INTERESTS through the entire transaction...." -
"I was being very facetious...couldn't you all figure that one out..?" -

Yes, I know you were being facetious; that was the point.  If you really were looking out for someone's "best" interests, you would at least be able to define what that was.  Not to mention, you wouldn't just be repeating misleading NAR propaganda talking points.
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April 04 2012
Profile picture for sunnyview
"Although I'm probably considered to be ANY agents nightmare, I'm studying to get my license! "

I have met some great agents that were clients who wanted a different kind of agent when they were buying or selling and had a hard time finding a good match. Good luck on the road to getting your license! With a little luck this house will still be for sale and you can be your own licensed buyer's agent :)
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April 04 2012
Profile picture for adosweet
LOL ! I LOVE a good debate, and ALL you people are great!! ' Pasadenan ', and ' Dan ' really hit the nail on the head, and Connie; you're soooooo right, because the ' listing-agent ' is DEFINITELY in my way! By the time everything is said and done, I think these sellers will agree with me. For now, I've decided to wait until a certain ' contract ' expires, and I personally told this to the sellers, as well. I'm not going to compromise my feelings for this agent, knowing what she's done, and still does, and gets away with it. I'm not going to be responsible for putting one more dime in her pouch! If I lose the house.......oh well....but I don't think I will. LOL Although I'm probably considered to be ANY agents nightmare, I'm studying to get my license! What I've been studying and what I've been witness to, are complete opposites! My idea of a " good " agent ( accorrding to the books, it's ' Salesman ' ! Go figure?) is one that ISN'T yet! LOL  If nothing else, I wouldn't answer EVERY question with " Get an agent " !!!  LOL  I appreciate ALL responses.
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April 04 2012
Now here is a secret.........I was being very facetious....or couldn't you all figure that one out yet!!!!????????
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April 04 2012
Now, how is that a "secret" when I've read it at least 3000 times on this website alone?


Shhhhh...we're trying to keep it a secret!
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April 04 2012
Profile picture for Pasadenan
"NOW HERE IS A SECRET.......A good buyers agent will look out for YOUR BEST INTERESTS through the entire transaction...." -

Now, how is that a "secret" when I've read it at least 3000 times on this website alone?

And so far, no "agent" has been able to answer what my "best interests" are, or how they determine if something is "best"?  Surely if it is "good", there might be something better?  For example, if I buy a $500,000 house for $50,000, that certainly seems to be "good" to me...  but is it the "best"?  What if you paid me $2,000,000 to take the house off your hands instead?  Wouldn't that be "better"?  But still it likely isn't the "best"....

Agents are often so careless with words, that it appears obvious to me they are "sales people" and not "client representatives".
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April 04 2012
-   I'm perfectly capable of dealing with this " agent " 

So, what's the problem, then?
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April 04 2012
Reading many of these comments .....All I have to say is shame on those of you that really do not have faith in a good buyers agent.  This has nothing to do whether the sellers agent gets both sides.  This sellers agent may be a selfish snake and only worried about himself, and the reason no one likes nor gets along with him is because they do not conduct their business this way.  But, he still may be legal.  However, with that being said, even if he was a moral agent, his fiduciary commitment is to his seller unless he signs in with you as a dual agent.
If you have never worked with a very good buyers agent, then those of you that do not see any value should not speak about something you never had any experience with.  We have all seen good attorneys and bad attorneys, good doctors and bad doctors.  Well its the same in most businesses.
Regardless of whether he is good or bad listing agent, he does not have your best interest at heart,  Actually if he was a real good agent and totally committed to his seller, his job is to get you to pay more.

NOW HERE IS A SECRET.......A good buyers agent will look out for YOUR BEST INTERESTS through the entire transaction.

He (or she) will run a market analysis with comparable and be completely honest of his opinion of value before your offer.

He will go over the sellers disclosure with you let you know any of his concerns.

He will point out flaws in the home that you might have missed going through buy yourself.
He will did for extra information about the sellers or the situation to put himself in a better negotiation position.

He will work against the other agent not with.

He will keep your buying power and what you are willing to pay confidential.

He will recommend the best home inspectors that may fit your personality and recommend you be there  during.

He will negotiate for you once again get repairs done by seller or credit for them.  He may even bluff to the other agent that you are willing to walk.  He would definitely come up with a strategy for based on his previous experience of the other agents personality.

He will know what is common to go after and what is not. 

He may recommend a contractor that he personally know to get an estimate that you both have a concern with first.

Based on his experience, he will recommend the best lenders that have the best rates, lowest fees, and wont give you problems when its time to close. (There are just some lenders that will not close on time.  And, you will have your movers already arranged and will be in tears)

He will make sure your lender will not order you appraisal until he is done negotiating your inspection results. (he will be well coordinated)

He will make sure you do your final walk thru prior to closing and know how to handle address many issues that do come up and still able to take you to closing.

He will recommend you a good closing attorney, that will explain your docs so you understand and will work with your schedule so you miss less work.

I sure I have forgot many other items that have come about for my buyers where I stood up made it right.  If they would have been alone, they would not know what to do or afraid to ask,,,or did not know they could.  Many of my clients have turned to me during a transaction and "I'm sure glad I had a buyers agent" 

And....to THAT GUY who thinks he can do it himself...Good luck...because I know you will miss something, an opportunity, a step you make think doesn't matter, or pay too much for  something...no matter how much you got them down.  You would be an idiot.  You would probably think it is ok to represent yourself in court too
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April 04 2012
Profile picture for sunnyview
@Thomas I think you may have misunderstood. The original poster adosweet was the one who said "My POINT is: I'm a customer, a consumer, OK? I didn't hire this snake..." My apologies for not putting "snake" in quotes the first time I typed it since it was a quote from someone else. 

Most agents are professionals and I respect the job they do. I appreciate good agents, but I dislike bad agents who give the hard working agents and the profession a bad name. 
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April 04 2012
As an agent, I'll say you don't need an agent; have your attorney handle it directly with the listing broker. S/He can also set up an LLC to protect your name from being disclosed.

I am sure that the listing agent would be more than happy to deal with your attorney - s/he would be getting both sides of the transaction.

Good luck.


Sunnyview - so hostile. Your were able to ascertain that this agent was "a snake" from the one sentence that included " where there's a DEFINITE conflict of interest, both personal and proffessional "(sic)? Really?
TT



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April 04 2012
The problem is that the seller has hired that agent and they are in your way. I assume this is the same house. You can only complain on your behalf and it sounds like the sellers have a legit complaint (if this is same house) but you don't have the ability to cut through that crap. Which is keeping you from what is likely an easy transaction. The "chain of command" is agent, broker, main broker ( if this is a chain) local board, state commission/Licensing authority and state board
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April 03 2012
Profile picture for sunnyview
"People say : " Suck it up" or " Get a buyer's agent ", etc, etc. NOT, cuz that makes it OK, and it's NOT OK!!! "

You are right it is not OK. I am not an agent, but my concern as regular person is that the agent you describe will be happy to manipulate and lie to you in their best interest. If you go to them directly, keep EVERYTHING in writing, bcc EVERY email and do not accept phone calls that are not recorded. It is basic protection that you need to have if a professional is already known to be a problem. Cover yourself so you can file a complaint if things go sideways.

Also, if they are the listing agent you need to ask for a rebate of part of their double sided commission. You should at least get something for having to deal with them. If they refuse then go shopping for an agent who is willing to deal with a snake for 2-3%. At least that way their office will not get the full 6%.

You are the buyer. You decide, but cover yourself or you will find you are not able to file and win a complaint either. Better to be prepared and not need it.
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April 03 2012

When the agent was released (fired?) from the dealings with your relative, was a formal complaint filed with the appropriate agencies? It just seems as if you have to focus on what you can actually DO in this situation. I always say there are two things you shouldn't waste time worrying about, the things you can change and the things you can't change...

I'm just not sure what can be DONE, other than tell the sellers you refuse to make an offer on the house while the present real estate agent is managing it,and reporting her to the proper agencies.

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April 03 2012
Profile picture for the_country_hick
You need an agent for only one reason. The MLS is locked up and if you do not have an agent representing you they will be representing the seller instead. If you could buy a house that was FSBO there is no need to use a agent.

As long as the current system is in place where you are forced to use an agent like it or not it is almost always better to use anyone except the listing agent.

It is like going to college. To get your degree you need to go to a classroom and listen to an instructor. All the instructor does is tell you what the book you have to buy already tells you. You are stuck in a system that may not make sense but has to be worked with.
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April 03 2012
Profile picture for adosweet
Ok.......I get the whole ' all-the-agents-think-I-need-an-agent ' thing! But.......with all due respect, I feel there's one too many with the sellers agent around? I'm perfectly capable of dealing with this " agent " , and I will, as opposed to having some other ' God knows who ', trying to speak for me too!!? My POINT is: I'm a customer, a consumer, OK? I didn't hire this snake, but indirectly, as the buyer, I'm helping to pay her commission! This person does NOT deserve a license; and despite the complaints filed against her, she manages to get away with all she's done, and hasn't done! Everyone is so nonchalant about these things; even on here, which really surprises me!! People say : " Suck it up" or " Get a buyer's agent ", etc, etc. NOT, cuz that makes it OK, and it's NOT OK!!!  I'm the one who found the house, and I'm the one who WILL buy the house!! Thank you all anyway!!
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April 03 2012
Profile picture for sunnyview
If the listing is held by the office that you do not want to deal with, there is not much you can do other than keep everything in writing with your buyer agent and with the listing agent.

When you hire a buyer's agent make it clear to them that you want ALL counters, disclosures, conversations etc in writing and sent by email with a bcc back to your agent. Keeping everything will not protect your from bad professional behavior, but good record keeping and a good buyers agent can make a bad listing agency behave just long enough for you to get the house you really want.
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April 03 2012
Olfe is right about it has to be an LLC if you want to be anonymous.
but really being anonymous doesn't sound like your need.  It sounds like you simply need someone to represent you and deal with the stress for you.

that is what buyer's agents do
there are plenty of good ones- more good ones than bad- it just seems like there are more bad ones because the bad ones get talked about more.
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April 03 2012
I started to respond and hadn't looked at the user name yet.
so first...I'd like to say...so sorry for all your frustration.
second.
definitely get a buyer's agent.  also, something to think on.
you can have your buyer's agent present your offer without your contact information- a sort of anonymous offer.  it's been done before.  Keep more than an arm's length.

so on that note.
I don't know anyone up that direction or I'd be on the phone reccommending that they get on here and make contact with you.
it's worthwhile to take a few minutes, call agents, visit with them about specifics of the situation and interview them to find one that is strong enough for what you need.  someone that is calm enough to just take care of business and not be reactive, someone with experience to get it done.
etc
it doesn't have to be that hard!  there's someone there that can help you I'm sure. 
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April 03 2012
You know in reality, you should hire someone (anyone?) to be your buyer's agent, if for no other reason than to keep this agent from getting both sides of the commission....
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April 03 2012
Profile picture for adosweet
Yes Ofe; negative on the professional level, due to a recent ' contract ' with one of my family members, which the agent was ' fired ' from for lying, among other things. Believe me.....there's no way I should have to be dealing with this agency, period!
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April 03 2012
You could get a buyer agent, but you cannot hide the names of the buyers unless you create an LLC and let the LLC purchase the property.  Even then a member will have to sign on behalf of the LLC. Are we to assume that the relationship is a negative one, because otherwise the relationship is disclosed and it becomes part of the offer.
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April 03 2012
If I wanted something like you say you do, I'd suck it up and go for it. Get a buyer broker so there is someone in the middle.  You don't pay for the buyer broker, the seller does. You do not have to speak to anyone on the sellers side of the transaction.  You do not have to sign papers in the same room. I would just go forward and get the home I want! 
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April 03 2012
 
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