Profile picture for oreo0240

The phone number for someone who can correct Zillow's error on square footage of our home is incorre

Zillow posts 1,470sf as the total area on our home and has valued our home at the 1,470sf.  Tax records give: 1st floor area: 1470sf; 2nd floor, blank; 3rd floor; loff; attic all blank. Then it states: TOTAL AREA: 1470sf.  Immediately below TOTAL AREA the county assessor's ofc post: BASEMENT AREA: 1345sf.  (That BASEMENT AREA has NOT been entered into Zillow's calculations which would substantially change your ZESTIMENT.  I have accessed Jefferson County Tax Records and have researched the sq footage of our neighbor's home, year, both assessed values and taxes owed for properties.  We have a higher assessed value and pay higher taxes, and have more square footage and newer than the property across the road from us which is a 1975 home and without a view of the Sound.  Please correct.  You have our property assessed at $265,000 while the other two I have identified immediately next to us is valued as an Zestimate as 291,000 and 294,000.  Your low Zestimate is hindering the sale of our home.  People do not read your disclaimer.  Buyers look at the asking price and the Zesitmate by Zillow.  Our experience is that the buyers want to offer a low price based on Zillow's unauthorized and uneducated estimate.  Simply correct the square footage by having your programming department include the BASEMENT AREA and add it to their TOTAL AREA and it will reflect the true square footage of the home and a more favorable Zestimate.  As I said, I have accessed the Jefferson County Assessor's records and have talked extensively with the member's therein and their tax info is correct and they will NOT change their taxing programs to accomodate Zillow or any other WEB site.  Zillow is the only site that gives their estimate, (which is sometimes WRONG and hurts the seller tremendously).  Please call: 360.821.8352
Thank you.  James Foster
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August 27 2013 - Port Ludlow
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Answers (22)

Profile picture for wetdawgs
Hunh? I never said what you claim I said.    

And, I'm not totally wrong.   I'm sorry you are having such a tough time selling your home that you have to go into attack mode.  It isn't going to help.  I hope you got your agent to correct her errors... looks like some are corrected but "roof: private road" suggests some more editing still needs to be done.  Paying attention to details is absolutely critical in the selling process.
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September 01 2013
Profile picture for oreo0240
WETDAWGS:  Per your statement that Zillow's zestimates are base solely on grade finished living area and that basement sq ft isn't of any importance to the evaluation of a home is totally inaccurate!  It is also inaccurate to state appraisers don't consider BASEMENT AREA.  BASEMENT AREA doesn't mean A DARK, CEMENT HOLE.  There are thousands of homes built on slopes with views of water and area, and these homes are FULLY FINISHED LIVING AREAS of mostly CUSTOM DESIGNED HOMES.  And you are wrong when you say, quote: "Occasionally agents or owners do edit adding the two together, but that's a great way to create very angry buyers." unquote.  You are TOTALLY WRONG!  Tax Assessor's combine the TOTAL AREA SQ FT with the BASEMENT SQFT and thus you are taxed accordingly.  Bankers consider the TOTAL HOUSE, not just the entry, up floors.  And appraisers calculate the TOTAL HOUSE, not just the entry and up.  All county appraisers and realtors refer to a house by two areas, simply because the county assesses taxes on two levels.  The county assessors do not include land improvements or inside home evaluations as part of their assessment for taxes. Perhaps you should council with the assessors before making uneducated statements.
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September 01 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
The public records is not the personal property of the home owners.  Public records belong to the American PUBLIC  (ALL of them).  And personal opinions (including machine opinions) are the private property of those that have those opinions.  Per the United States Constitution, people are free to share their opinions, and to publish them, even if they are not U.S. citizens.

Who's lying anyway???  We keep hearing that "complaint" is that Zillow claimed that a specific property is worth less than the list price.  That is 100% FALSE!  In the past 7 years, Zillow NEVER claimed the value of the property was less than the list price...  In fact, Zillow always claimed that the value of the property was approximately the list price, and continues to post that opinion.

As for powers in numbers?   Yes, over 20 MILLION people have stated they want Zillow to post Zestimates, and only about 200 people have stated they want to file a class action lawsuit.  And of those 200?  None of them are willing to pay the legal fees.

As for being a "public company"?  Well over a majority of the stock ownership votes are controlled by only 2 people.  Even if you owned a share or two of stock, which you obviously wouldn't since you hate the company, you don't get to vote.  And even if you did get to vote, your vote doesn't count as only 2 people have ownership control over Zillow.

Also remember, a large portion of the revenue for the site comes from "page views" due to "Google Ads" and other advertisement, thus every time you post on Zillow, you are CHOOSING to help pay for Zestimates to be posted on the home details page for your house.

Of course, we all know it is just a ploy to get people to look at your home details page.   But if you really believed that people shouldn't financially support Zillow, you would put your money where your mouth is, and not have a Realtor represent you that chooses to pay to advertise on Zillow as a "premier agent", and you would choose to not post your listing on this website.  There are thousands of other places to advertise.  No one needs to use this site if they don't like it.

As for a monopoly?  Yes, the National Association of Realtors has had a monopoly for decades, and buyers and sellers and agents still choose to support the monopoly.  As a media company, Zillow has no monopolies of any kind, and doesn't claim any, even though the get more website traffic than the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Post, and the New York Times combined.
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August 30 2013
Profile picture for oreo0240
TO THE (PERSONAL MODERATOR WHO POSTED I MADE AN ATTACK AND USED ***** AS AN EXPLATIVE ON YOUR SITE)   You LIE, I don't use fowl language and obviously you are afraid to show me.... you obviously can change the content and say what you want.  Zillow is garbage! and shamefully they are a public company that thinks they are a monopoly and can be a dictatorship.  Things must change.  Zillow cannot continue to post erroneous estimates on people's property and hurt the sellers.  The properties are not owned by Zillow.
Users of Zillow... there is power in numbers:

[redundant.  Deleted by Zillow moderator.] 
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August 30 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
woops...  typo... left off the "s"... that is mcZigs, also known as ThePhotoGiftMaker

Saying that Spencer can be reached at mcZigs is like saying that the CEO of Zillow can be reached at 360-437-0412 and that calling that number would allow any desired number to be posted for the  Zestimate at any time?   Apparently calling that number also is a simple way to change the square footage of any property in the county records too?
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August 30 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
Oreo is waging a media campaign against mcZig  ?   Pretty funny!  LOL!
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August 30 2013
Profile picture for wetdawgs
Out of curiosity, have you read the details for your agent's listing feed to Zillow?   Here's a link.  I would be furious with the agent's sloppiness, yet you wrote a positive review for the agent in March, 2013.

Here are examples of things I find rather curious copied and pasted directly from your agent's CB site, not from Zillow:

Outdoor
Exterior: Walk-in Closet
Body of Water: Canal
Exterior: Water Feature
Exterior: Dry Bar
Exterior Living Space: Wood Siding
Exterior: Thermal Windows / Doors
Lot Size: Patio
Style: Custom
Exterior: High Tech Cabling
Road Type: Wall to Wall Carpet
Exterior Description: Private Road
Road Type: Hardwood
Heating Type: Attached Garage
Garage Description: Residential
Kitchen Features: Stall Shower and Tub

As a buyer, I'd prefer my shower and tub to be in the bathroom not kitchen.  I'd also not like to have a hardwood and carpet road.  Even gravel is better.
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August 29 2013
Profile picture for wetdawgs
The FTC has already offered an opinion in response to complaints about Zillow's Zestimates.  They tossed out the case as frivolous (as mentioned previously. Please look it up).

Zillow's corporate offices are not in Spokane.    Their real address is offered on this website.

The statement that Zillow's business license expired in 2005 is amusing, as Zillow started as a business in 2006.
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August 29 2013
Profile picture for oreo0240
[personal attack deleted by Zillow moderator} there are a lot of people who  feel ZILLOW IS ABUSIVE and HOSTAL.  I feel the same about ****** Zillow.
And others who join the VICTIMS of Zillow, sell your stock and write:

Federal Trade Commission, 600 Pennsylvania Av. NW, Washington DC, 20580, phone: 877-382-4357; ZILLOW'S BUS. LICENSE NUMBER: 602-453354; CEO is Spencer Rascoff; Zillow Corp Ofc., 27 W Indiana Av., Spokane, WA (get zip from PO); per WA BBB, their Registered Agent, (no name on record), 505 Union Av SE., Suite 120, Olympia, WA 98501; write the AG, BBB, get on FACEBOOK, TWITTER, and any other sites you know and please SHARE THEM. Zillow's phone though they don't answer or respond other than their non-sense disclaimers is: 206-470-7000 x 1503.
With numbers, we can unite as one and get changes.  All I have ever asked is "your estimate is wrong, don't care about your graphs, maps, etc., but please remove your erroneous estimate," and Zillow refuses.  Their unsolicited, unprofessional and unlicensed estimates are not welcome.  Viewers assume Zillow's estimates are correct and accurate.  They don't care about the graphs, buyers are looking for the most at the least amount.  Fortunately, we do not have to sell, we simply want to sell, but that is not the point. Those who do want to sell and are in a position of being forced to sell or a great need to sell are being hurt by Zillow's inaccurate estimates. Those people are not licensed in Real Estate nor are they licensed as Appraisers.[deleted by Zillow moderator. violation of Good Neighbor Policy.]and others are no better than Zillow whether they work for Zillow or whatever. Don't give up, join the others and write and continue writing the above until changes are RESPECTED, and CHANGED. email: 
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August 29 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
No, I don't work for Zillow, and have absolutely no connection to Zillow.

Lie?  Why don't you check with your agent?  She "chose" to be a "premier agent" to advertise her "services", not her "listings".  Sure, that means her listings (and thus your listing) is a "featured" listing instead of just an ordinary listing, bumping it up on the search results list, but it doesn't "need" to be a "featured" listing, and anyone, ANYONE can post for FREE, including agents.

Zillow does NOT get most of their Revenue from Realtors... this is not NAR, this is not the MLS, this is not Realtor.com... only about 30% or less of the revenue comes from agents.  about 30% from Loan officers.  About 30% from "Google Ads" (based on page views), and then all kinds of other "sponsorship ads"  (Such as Lowes)  and "targeted ads".

Are you stating you want to sue me to for telling you the "truth"? Or perhaps you want me to file formal complaints against your agent on behalf of the hundreds of people that viewed your intentionally deceptive listing on over 6 different websites?

Keep ranting and raving about how you are going to sue and create a viral boycott.You don't have the money nor the guts nor the grounds to sue.  And if you were so good about making things go viral, your home would have been sold 45 days ago with 200 million views.

The only one loosing any sleep over your rants is yourself.

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August 29 2013
Profile picture for hpvanc
I'm not with Zillow, and use many websites for information.

Zillow is a media company, so they sell advertising. To agents, mortgage companies, home improvement retailers, and anyone who wants to buy an ad. They sell some strategically targeted advertising to both real estate agents and lenders. In the case of real estate agents that advertising includes featured listings, however they don't currently charge an agent or a property owner to ad their ad to the Zillow provided content about a property.

Yes agents are buying advertising from Zillow, they want to advertise where their consumer market is. Many of the agents that pay for advertising feel just as strongly about AVM's as you seem to, however consumers are coming to the website making it an attractive place to advertise their listings, and to pay to advertise their services.

Zillow has developed a consumer reputation of being an independent consumer centric media company, that is going rub many agents and some sellers the wrong way.

Have you paid to have your property appraised by a certified appraiser in the last 2-3 months? You could share that number as your estimate and include it as one of the photos on your listing. No, in answer to your likely question, showing a certified appraisal will not change the Zestimate, but if you include it as one of the photos on your listing will show to potential buyers an estimate from a more authoritative source.
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August 29 2013
Profile picture for oreo0240
deleted by Zillow moderator. violation of Good Neighbor Policy.] Coldwell Banker's broker told us they PAY ZILLOW, how else can you support 500 employees, as you stated.  And to attempt to threaten or scare me is of no use... I don't run and as an individual, I don't PAY the atty's to represent US on a "class action law suit".
If you represent or are Zillow, it is so easy, like Trulia NOT to post your UNAUTHORIZED, UNEDUCATED, UNLICENSED opinion on VALUES of homeowners properties.
Everyone... get on FACEBOOK and JOIN the "CLASS-ACTION".  There are lots of QUALIFIED attorneys that will be happy to represent us.  Don't let someone like Zillow, "deleted by Zillow moderator. violation of Good Neighbor Policy.] intimidate you.

ZILLOW BUSINESS LICENSE: 602-453354; per BBB another addr without a name is: 999 - 3rd AV., Suite 4600, Seattle, WA 98104; FEDERAL TRADE COMMISSION, 601 PENNSYLVANIA AV NW, WA DC 20580, PHONE: 877-382-4357, email: FTC.GOV; IRS; BBB; Zillow Corp Ofc., 27 W Indiana Av., Spokane, WA (get zip from PO); Zillow Inc., 1301-2nd Av., Suite 3100, Seattle, WA 98101; ZILLOW'S REGISTERED AGENT: 505 Union Av SE, Suite 120, Olympia, WA 98501; Zillow's phone number, though they don't respond and if they do it is an email directing you to their disclaimers... no value, they won't

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August 29 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
"Agents "pay" Zillow to put their listings on the web." -

Not true, it is "FREE", absolutely no cost to the agent to post any listings on this site.

"Zillow is no better than a newspaper." -

Zillow is NO DIFFERENT than a newspaper... it is a MEDIA company, and only a media company, thus they are entitled to post as much editorial content as they wish, especially since it is all posted as "editorial comment" with hundreds of legal disclaimers.
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August 29 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
Yes, there are approximately 200 people out of over 60 million users of the website that have expressed that they would like to join a class action lawsuit, as long as YOU pay the legal fees.  They are extremely easy to look up, just like it is easy to look up that the ONLY claim that Zillow made about the value of YOUR house is that there is a 70% chance that the present market value falls somewhere between $236k and $412k.

And yes, Zillow does do automate new "ESTIMATES" nominally 3 times per week.  A new one was just ran again last night.

The reason you are getting very few offers even though well over 700 page views is it is obvious that the Realtor is including the basement in the livable floor space, which is "deceptive" at best.

I don't know who you think you are trying to convince to "join you" in your "frustration".    Nobody reading your posts is interested.
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August 29 2013
Profile picture for oreo0240

deleted by Zillow moderator. violation of Good Neighbor Policy.]  ...Zillow's original map showed an estimate based on 1470sf and they used a value of $254k.  They replaced their zestimate with the realtors home page and the asking price.  The 2815sf is the total finished quality custom home.  125sf is the partially finished storage room.  And for your information and others, the Jefferson County Assessor's base the taxes on the value of the property WITHOUT IMPROVEMENTS and the sq footage of the entry lvl up at a higher tax rate ,which includes first, second, third, loff and attic as: TOTAL AREA, and the area classified as: BASEMENT AREA is taxed at a lower rate.  THEY DO NOT BASE THEIR ASSESSMENTS ON THE QUALITY OR CONDITION INSIDE THE HOUSE, BOTH UPPER AND LOWER.  AND FURTHERMORE, BASEMENT AREA DOES NOT MEAN A COLD, DARK UNFINISH AREA.  ZILLOW'S estimates are WRONG... their estimate's, as you claim are automated and taken from county records, of which county rec

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August 29 2013
Profile picture for wetdawgs
Many people  request that their agents advertise without AVMs.   Have you made that request?   Then your agent would remove your property from Zillow and other websites with AVMs.

Others have initiated lawsuits as well  have filed with the FTC.  You may wish to spend some time investigating the outcome before spending your money. 

With the kerfuffle, I was astonished to learn your Zestimate is less than 10% from your asking price, and the value range includes your asking price. 


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August 29 2013
Profile picture for oreo0240

[replicated.  deleted by Zillow moderator]

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August 29 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
By the way, Zillow has indicated on the home details page that your square footage is 2,815 sqft since July 14, 2013, and THAT is the number that is used in the estimates.  Sure, the "revision" is phased into the estimates over about 60 days, but it has already been about 45 days, so that is already mostly accounted for.
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August 29 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
Yes, you have posted the same thing about 10 times, it does no good to keep repeating it; most people don't read the discussion forum (especially not Zillow employees)  Look at the "view counter" at the top of the page just above and to the right of the thread title.  At least 50 other people have posted the same opinion in the past 6 years... you are not posting anything that those reading the thread have not already read dozens of times.

There is NO WHERE in the U.S. where a "license" is required to post an "opinion" of "approximate value".  There is no license required of any kind for AVM's.  AVM's are NOT appraisals, never claim to be, and never will be.  CMA's are not appraisals either, and Real Estate agents are not licensed as appraisers either.

The Federal Trade Commission doesn't care.  This is not a "trade" issue, and is not under their jurisdiction.  And trying to regulate AVM's when they are created for hundreds of different purposes is presently impossible, especially considering the competitive growth still required in the AVM industry.  Trying to "regulate it" would just mean Zillow would be "forced" to publish an estimate for your house of 50% of the list price.

It has been discussed before; if you want it changed, you need to approach your congress representatives, but they have no desire to make such changes.  They can't even agree on a budget for the year starting October 1, nor the Debt ceiling limit that will be reached sometime in October this year.

Sure, you can sue if you want.  It is your constitutional right.  Others have tried, the cases have been dismissed.  Yes, I would love to see you pay your attorney $100k this year, plus have to pay for Zillow's lawyers too.  (Especially since Zillow's estimate does not disagree with your asking price).  For information on how to sue, see Zillow's Terms of Use, paragraph 15.
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August 28 2013
Profile picture for oreo0240
I respect your opinions, yet I strongly disagree with you and this Pasadean person who doesn't offer a response to his/her out-going message.  A home owner should NOT be imprisoned by Zillow inaccurate out going estimates.  They are not LICENSED TO BE R/E AGENTS, APPRAISORS, or anything other.z  Their disclaimers are not valued by buyers.  A home owner should have the RIGHT to REFUSE THEIR ESTIMATES, BOTH ON THE MAP AND IN THE CONTENTS OF THE R/E LISTING.  The Agent has the info correct.  The WEB company, Zillow has the WRONG VALUE and it hurts the sale (I feel) of our home.

Another source to complain and request EQUAL RIGHTS for publications is with the Federal Trade Commission within each homeowners state.  ZILLOW'S BUSINESS LICENSE IS: 602-453354 and their agent's address is: 999-3rd Av., Suite 4600,Seattle, WA 98104 per the WA BBB. Contact your BBB; IRS; Zillow Inc., 1301 - 2nd Av., Suite 3100, Seattle, WA 98101; Zillow Corp Office, 27 W Indiana Av., Spokane, WA (get zip from PO); Zillow ph: 206-470-7000 x 1503 and go viral via Facebook, Twitter, etc.

If Zillow has the unsolicited, unauthorized permission from the seller to post their estimates without State's Licenses, then they should RESPECT the RIGHTS of the Seller and remove their ERRONEOUS estimates and information they publish and submit ONLY THE DATA THE AGENTS PROVIDE.  As it is, they (Zillow) REFUSES TO REMOVE THEIR UNSOLICITED information.  They are not QUALIFIED to make such decisions on other people's property.  I don't need negative publicity.  Simply (all those who are unhappy with Zillow) publish your greivance and write the above.  We home/property owners have RIGHTS too...Zillow doesn't have the RIGHT to continue business with negative output.

Again, our home is the nicest, without question in the development.  It is under-priced as it is already, at our request.  You try to build a 2940sf, custom home with hardwood floors, marble fireplace, concrete tile roof, and completely finished daylite basement for $287,000 and don't forget to add in your view 2/3 ac land (water view), plus another $50k for property improvements, incl'dg 3 brick patios, 2 NEW CEDAR DECKS, brick paths, KOI pond with 2 water falls, and loads of stone-ware pot and periential flowers, shrubs and trees.  Then look at the low-ball Zillow estimate of $265k and compare with the neighbors bare, weed filled properties and homes that are with fake flooring, metal free standing fireplace, wall heat, composition roofs and less sf, and I could go on and on, yet Zillow prices these substandard homes higher (291,000; 294,000; 360,000 and so on).  WE PAY MORE TAXES and OURS IS ASSESSED HIGHER.  You would NOT BE HAPPY IF THIS WAS YOUR HOME AND YOU WERE CAUGHT UP IN A VICIOUS CIRCLE with Zillow.  All they have to do is REMOVE THEIR CRAP FROM MY HOME. (PERIOD!)
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August 28 2013
Profile picture for Pasadenan
"Zillow is the only site that gives their estimate" -

Unfortunately, that is just "incorrect"...  here are some other sites that provide their machine estimates for at no cost to the user:

finestexpert.com

Realestate.com/homepricecheck

homes.com

Homesand.net

Eppraisal

realquest.com express

cyberhomes.com

trulia

chase

homegain

smartzip

dataquick

And then there are dozens that charge for their AVM's, that aren't any better than the free ones, nor any better than typical CMA's by Realtors with less than a high-school math back ground.

And then there are the hundreds of "private" AVM's own by various financial institutions and business ventures for in-house use.  And then there are the estimates done at multiple universities across the country.

Yes, you have a First Amendment right to publish your opinion and to complain that your asking price listed by your agent exactly what Zillow's automated machine estimate indicates it should be based on the 70% confidence interval posted with every estimate.  But if you "think" that you are doing something new and going to change the way Zillow does business by posting 2 hours every day for the next two years, you might want to read the thread:

Zestimate is raising questions with buyers of my property - estimate doesn't make sense

Nothing "new"... nothing "noteworthy", though you have several misconceptions, and obviously don't care to see things different.

Zillow has less than 10% market share of AVM's, and theirs cannot be used for any business purpose of any kind, so if you are worried about the potential influence of AVM's, you are spending your time in the wrong location.  Some suggested lobbying your congress representatives... but they have no intention of reversing the First Amendment to the U.S. constitution either.
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August 28 2013
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The square footage shown prominently on Zillow is the above grade finished living area.   Zillow does not add basement sq ft to above grade square footage with  homes to show a total area.   (This is normal with appraisers also, as basement square footage adds considerably less value per square foot than above grade square footage).    The basement square footage should be shown separately when you click on the words "see data sources" on your home details page. Basement adds value (the amount depends on finish) but less than above grade    Occasionally agents or owners do edit adding the two together, but that's a great way to create very angry buyers.

There are over a dozen sites that give free AVMs.  
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August 27 2013
 
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The phone number for someone who can correct Zillow's error on square footage of our home is incorre
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September 01 2013 | 22 answers
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