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Replies (20)
- Patty Everitt, "peveritt"
- Contributions:138
Hi, I will let you know the listing agent is the agent for the Seller, not always does the agent get to be aware of the bottom number the Seller's will take , but sometimes they do know important information the Seller's dont want the Buyer's to know usually about the purchase price. For your benefit the other agent would then be an agent for you, your interests in the fore-front. I am presently listing with one Seller and she does not want be to roll to a Buyers agent during any transaction only going into the Transitional broker mode, which is then a person that cannot advise on either side. so yes it can get confusing. For your protection, knowing the comparatives of the area, what the recent sale was and dont worry about the house price the percentage for the agents is already built in to the price, or the Seller will have a bottom line regarding that. -Good Luck !
- John Stewart, "nwhome.us"
- Contributions:2166
Kill the spell check editor. Sometimes I hate this interface. It doesn't like it when you go over 2000 characters and it doesn't allow you to edit it once you have. Sorry for the mash up on that post.
- John Stewart, "nwhome.us"
- Contributions:2166
Here's the clean one:
What I might suggest is that you do a search on this site with the word "agency" in it; buyer agency and seller agency into that box up there that has "Questions, Keywords, or Topics" in it now. You'll find enough reading there to last hours.
The basics are this:
The seller and the listing agent have an agreement signed that indicates that the seller will pay the listing agent a commission on the sale of the home. When the listing agent enters the listing into the local MLS they agree (separately from the agreement with the seller) to split their commission with any agent that brings a buyer to the table. An exclusive Buyer's agent cannot interfere with the listing agreement. If you work directly with the listing agent (who is a party to that agreement) you may have some leverage to alter it.
Here's a link to the Washington Law of Real Estate Agency. In some states the rules fall under a more general "Agency" law.
In what you have described so far it doesn't appear as though you have an obligation to either of these agents at the moment. However if you have the lisitng agent show you the home, it can be argued that you initiated an agency relationship and "due cause" might establish them as the "buyer's agent" for that property.
From what I hear you saying, between the lines that you write, I'd recommend that you find one agent that you trust and use them as your buyer's agent. If they are a good negotiator and do a thorough job of research, they will be able to get you a better price than a listing agent who is discounting their listing commission. There is no end to the time it takes to interview and select a good agent for yourself, just be up front about it: "I'm interviewing agents and I'd like to have you show me this house and see if we might work together on this process". This could go on for hours.
- Sam DeBord, "SeattleHome.com"
- Contributions:3472
Decide who you'd like to work with. Call that person every time. Any agent can show you any home, but you'll get much more reliable service when you are loyal to one agent.
Have a buyer's agent. They will represent your side in the negotiation, not the seller's. The buyer's agent gets paid through the seller's commission, not directly by you.
Have a buyer's agent. They will represent your side in the negotiation, not the seller's. The buyer's agent gets paid through the seller's commission, not directly by you.
- Kimberly Brandon, CRS,GRI,SFR, "KimberlyBrandon"
- Contributions:260
You have already received some great advice -
One thing I'd like to make clear - having a seller's agent and a buyer's agent involved in a sale will NOT increase the commission.
Now agency laws vary state to state. Florida does not allow 'Dual Agency' - but a listing agent can still work with the buyer - as a transaction broker
Agency is best explained by a good agent face to face.
Seller's usually interview two, three sometimes four agents before they select who they will have market their property. As a buyer - why would not do the same thing. Wouldn't you like an agent with experience?
To be sure of this check for designations GRI (graduate of the Realtor Institute) is good and the one I consider the best is CRS (certified residential specialist) I think it is best because only 4% of the agents nationwide have the training, education and experience to be awarded this designation. They have website you can search by area www.crs.com.
Also ABR - a designation for buyer's agents.
Look up 3 or 4 local agents and set up to interview them.
Ask them if you will be dealing with them or do they work as a team or have an assistant. How will they help you find a home? Ask why you should work with them? Once you make your selection be loyal. No one likes to work for free. If you have questions - call that agent - even if it is just the price of house you are driving by.....
And one last piece of advice - Buy a house in a great school zone even if you don't have kids - for resale - it matters....
Hope this helps...Kimberly
One thing I'd like to make clear - having a seller's agent and a buyer's agent involved in a sale will NOT increase the commission.
Now agency laws vary state to state. Florida does not allow 'Dual Agency' - but a listing agent can still work with the buyer - as a transaction broker
Agency is best explained by a good agent face to face.
Seller's usually interview two, three sometimes four agents before they select who they will have market their property. As a buyer - why would not do the same thing. Wouldn't you like an agent with experience?
To be sure of this check for designations GRI (graduate of the Realtor Institute) is good and the one I consider the best is CRS (certified residential specialist) I think it is best because only 4% of the agents nationwide have the training, education and experience to be awarded this designation. They have website you can search by area www.crs.com.
Also ABR - a designation for buyer's agents.
Look up 3 or 4 local agents and set up to interview them.
Ask them if you will be dealing with them or do they work as a team or have an assistant. How will they help you find a home? Ask why you should work with them? Once you make your selection be loyal. No one likes to work for free. If you have questions - call that agent - even if it is just the price of house you are driving by.....
And one last piece of advice - Buy a house in a great school zone even if you don't have kids - for resale - it matters....
Hope this helps...Kimberly
- Jeff Konstant, "jkonstant"
- Contributions:1970
Agency laws are not written as clearly as they should be. There also seems to be some mis-understanding regarding listing agents automatically representing the seller. This might be true, but it also might not. The same can be said about working with your own agent to buy a home. They may or may not actually be your agent in the literal sense. Do some research ont he subject as it related to your state and be careful what you agree to. Keep as muc confidential info to yourself no matter what you do.
Finally as it relates to commission. It most certainly is possible to recieve a better price when working with the listing agent. No guarantees, but possible. Often a listing agent will reduce the commission agreement with the seller to get a deal done. If they have already agreed to 6% but your offer comes close enough that they can cut 1 or 2 percent, the agent and broker will still make more money. One of the difficulties here is agents more often than not are not able to actually make that decision. Often it lies with the relationship they have with the broker and the broker's relationship with the franchise. The fewer fees an agent has to pay and the fewer fees the broker or agent has to pay to the be a franchise, the better chance you have that an agent might be permitted or able to reduce the commission. It often does go beyond just the listing agreement terms.
It comes down to the agency relationship you establish with the agent (listing agent or your own), the relationship they have with the seller (if you use the listing agent) and the relationship the agent (any agent) has with their broker.
I am a strong advocate for dual agency or transaction agency and dislike the use of fear by many agents as a reason a buyer or seller should avoid them. I think the use of fear only enhances the feelings of mistrust that already exist in our field. I see it this way. I am hired by a seller to sell their home. Who then is best qualfied to do it? Just because the seller think I am is no reason a buyer should believe they will be ripped off, cheated or otherwise shortchanged by my services because I have my sign in a yard.
Finally as it relates to commission. It most certainly is possible to recieve a better price when working with the listing agent. No guarantees, but possible. Often a listing agent will reduce the commission agreement with the seller to get a deal done. If they have already agreed to 6% but your offer comes close enough that they can cut 1 or 2 percent, the agent and broker will still make more money. One of the difficulties here is agents more often than not are not able to actually make that decision. Often it lies with the relationship they have with the broker and the broker's relationship with the franchise. The fewer fees an agent has to pay and the fewer fees the broker or agent has to pay to the be a franchise, the better chance you have that an agent might be permitted or able to reduce the commission. It often does go beyond just the listing agreement terms.
It comes down to the agency relationship you establish with the agent (listing agent or your own), the relationship they have with the seller (if you use the listing agent) and the relationship the agent (any agent) has with their broker.
I am a strong advocate for dual agency or transaction agency and dislike the use of fear by many agents as a reason a buyer or seller should avoid them. I think the use of fear only enhances the feelings of mistrust that already exist in our field. I see it this way. I am hired by a seller to sell their home. Who then is best qualfied to do it? Just because the seller think I am is no reason a buyer should believe they will be ripped off, cheated or otherwise shortchanged by my services because I have my sign in a yard.
- STEVE SAMYN, "AgentSteve"
- Contributions:57
Definately have your own agent represent your interests. As the sellers agent, most of the time they have a fiduciary responsibility created by an agency relationship to work the transaction to the benefit of the seller. While it is true that some sellers agents may have a lower commission if there is not a second agent involved (not that many do this) the benefits to you of having your own representation far outweigh that possibility. For example, an experienced agent can protect you with certain inspections that you may not have thought to put in your offer which could save you from being stuck with a problem property or expensive repairs later on. The obvious benefit is that your own agent will provide you with all of the recent sales data instead of only the data that would support the sellers price and terms. Also, when you are loyal to one agent that agent will see that you will eventually buy through them thus anabling that agent to be a real estate counselor and negotiator for you instead of meerly trying to sell you something.
Think about it. Would OJ have done so well in court without his own representation working on his behalf? Knowledge is power in these transactions which is why you should have an experienced agent on your side.
Think about it. Would OJ have done so well in court without his own representation working on his behalf? Knowledge is power in these transactions which is why you should have an experienced agent on your side.
- Taya Abbott, "Taya Abbott"
- Contributions:139
It is commendable that you at least feel like maybe you should use the first agent in buying the house. Just because you called the listing agent does not mean the listing agent has to show you the property. Just let the first agent know you want to see it. Also, it is often advisable to have your own agent when looking at properties. They will look out for your best interest and not that of the seller. It's a nice balance with a big investment.
- Dana Brown, "DanaDuzDenver"
- Contributions:54
Here in Colorado the agent which shows you - takes you TO the property - is usually considered the "procuring cause" for the sale. Keep in mind, as others have said, the listing agent works on behalf of the seller to get the most $$$ for the house..... You would be better off using your own "Buyer's Agent" who represents YOU throughout the transaction! If you like the agent you started with, stay the course and let that agent show you the homes! Good luck - it's great to see that you have concern for doing the right thing! WOW!
- Scott Frey, "scottmfrey"
- Contributions:4
As an agent myself, I'd certainly want you to work with me if I'd been spending time showing you properties, and sending you listings to consider. I work hard to earn trust and committment from my clients. But, until you've signed a Buyer-Broker agreement, you are not bound to work with any particular agent. However, I believe that it would be best for you to work with a buyer's agent so you have someone legally bound to look out for you in the transaction.
The listing agent owes a fiduciary responsibility to represent the seller's interests. In Ohio, real estate agents can act as dual agents and represent both buyer and seller. For me, I've never been a big fan of that arranagement because as buyer or seller, all you end up with in a dual agent is a "gopher" and "go-between" who relays offers back and forth and helps guide the process. The dual agent is forbidden from advocating for either side since they represent both. Dual agency can work well in some cases.
As for compensation, often times in Ohio, the buyer's agent will get their portion of the commission from the sale from the listing agent's commission. This doesn't necessarily result in a higher home price as the listing agent has his or her commission already built into the list price. The buyer's agent commission doesn't get added to that unless they negotiate it that way.
If you are serious about buying a home, I'd say find a buyer's agent you trust and feel comfortable with and commit to working with them so you have solid representation in the transaction.
The listing agent owes a fiduciary responsibility to represent the seller's interests. In Ohio, real estate agents can act as dual agents and represent both buyer and seller. For me, I've never been a big fan of that arranagement because as buyer or seller, all you end up with in a dual agent is a "gopher" and "go-between" who relays offers back and forth and helps guide the process. The dual agent is forbidden from advocating for either side since they represent both. Dual agency can work well in some cases.
As for compensation, often times in Ohio, the buyer's agent will get their portion of the commission from the sale from the listing agent's commission. This doesn't necessarily result in a higher home price as the listing agent has his or her commission already built into the list price. The buyer's agent commission doesn't get added to that unless they negotiate it that way.
If you are serious about buying a home, I'd say find a buyer's agent you trust and feel comfortable with and commit to working with them so you have solid representation in the transaction.
- Steve Samyn, "Steve55193789"
- Contributions:42
Would like to see you stay with the original agent who has shown you other homeslly the sellers agent is legally bound to negotiate to benefit the seller. Depending on the sellers fee agreement there may be no difference in sellers fees having 2 agents. Listing agent could just be paid both sides of the commission and you would not have representation.
I would stick with the first agent for your best interest.
I would stick with the first agent for your best interest.
- Tina Cole, "Tina Cole"
- Contributions:103
We Realtors get paid by the Seller not the Buyer. We do this for a living, and driving you around costs us money. The first Realtor has already spent time and money on you. So please, if you like the first Realtor and he or she seems knowledgeable, go with your first Realtor. They can look up any listing in MLS, from any Office. We all cooperate with one another. The price does not go up, the price is the same. The commission is the same, just split between two Realtors/Office instead of the One. Ask you first Realtor to show you any lising you see, then you only have one person to deal with not many different Realtors. Remember, we get paid by commission only. Its much easier if you only work with one Realtor.
- Chris O'Connor, "CallChrisToday"
- Contributions:269
What is the ethical thing to do?
If the first Realtor was working for you already AND doing a decent job you should stick with them. The entire reason that Realtor spent their time and money helping you is because they expected your loyalty. And you owe them this loyalty. And most importantly it is in your best interest to establish rapport and mutual trust and respect with your agent.
Many buyers mistakenly think that they will get a better deal on a home if they go behind their Realtors back and work directly with the listing agent. The reality is doing this only results in the listing agent making 2x as much commission. And now you don't have anyone that is working diligently FOR you.
Yes, as a transaction broker the listing agent has fiduciary duties to not do anything to harm you, but common sense should tell you that the listing agent has a genuine relationship with the sellers and is not going to represent your best interest like that Realtor who just spent their hard-earned cash driving you around showing you houses all day.
It sounds like you know what the right thing to do is.
If the first Realtor was working for you already AND doing a decent job you should stick with them. The entire reason that Realtor spent their time and money helping you is because they expected your loyalty. And you owe them this loyalty. And most importantly it is in your best interest to establish rapport and mutual trust and respect with your agent.
Many buyers mistakenly think that they will get a better deal on a home if they go behind their Realtors back and work directly with the listing agent. The reality is doing this only results in the listing agent making 2x as much commission. And now you don't have anyone that is working diligently FOR you.
Yes, as a transaction broker the listing agent has fiduciary duties to not do anything to harm you, but common sense should tell you that the listing agent has a genuine relationship with the sellers and is not going to represent your best interest like that Realtor who just spent their hard-earned cash driving you around showing you houses all day.
It sounds like you know what the right thing to do is.
- Michel Thonissen, "Michel Thonissen"
- Contributions:28
In my opinion it is never a good idea to work with a listing agent as a buyer. Keep in mind that the llisting agent has the seller's best interest and mind and rightfully so. What you need to do is go back to the first agent and sign up with him or her on a buyers representation agreement. That will give you the protection you need.
- Nathan Perz, "NathanPerz"
- Contributions:61
It would be hard to say that you "owe" the first agent anything. If (s)he invested time in you without an agency agreement, then that's the chance you take.
Although keep in mind: wouldn't you rather have an agent working exclusively for you? Do you really want to work with the seller's agent? If you liked the first agent, stick with her (or him).
Although keep in mind: wouldn't you rather have an agent working exclusively for you? Do you really want to work with the seller's agent? If you liked the first agent, stick with her (or him).
- Mike Vazquez, Realtor at ERA, "Mike Vazquez"
- Contributions:62
The earlier point about the money "commissions" staying the same was a good point and one that I don't think many consumers understand (though I know there are also many that do). In our area the seller typically lists a home for a certain fee, and if there is one agent typically that fee is kept by the listing agent whether they represent both sides (called a dual agent) or not. And, if there is another agent ( a buyer's agent) that that fee gets split between the two agents. So having your own agent doesn't add to the cost of the transaction, it primarily just benefits you by having someone in your own corner looking out for only your interests.
Good Luck
- Seth Captain, "CaptainSeth"
- Contributions:142
You may want to consider an ultimate fighting match. If they really want your business they will do it. This will make your decision both easier and more enjoyable.
If that sounds too aggressive, and you prefer a softer agent, you can have them each write you a letter explaining why they should be your agent. As a bonus question, ask what three famous people in history they would invite to dinner.
If that sounds too aggressive, and you prefer a softer agent, you can have them each write you a letter explaining why they should be your agent. As a bonus question, ask what three famous people in history they would invite to dinner.
- George Belleville, "George Belleville"
- Contributions:144
I would just like to say thank you, on behalf of all agents, for wanting to do the right thing! We appreciate it.
- Jack Dudenhoeffer, Broker, "cycad1234"
- Contributions:22
Go with an experienced buyer's agent/broker. Find someone who excels in their area of expertise, who is a skilled negotiator. The listing broker has a fiduciary duty to the seller and one should have good representation as a buyer.
Find a good agent and then be loyal as their time is all they have to work with and they work on a commission basis!
Good luck!
Find a good agent and then be loyal as their time is all they have to work with and they work on a commission basis!
Good luck!
- Lisa Dunlap, "Lisa Dunlap"
- Contributions:1
What is considered fair and ethical by the real estate community, is that yyou keep in mind when you are using a realtor's time, that time is not free, so try not to call upon agents willy nilly. Seek out a good agent, commit yourself to work with them, and don't just call the listing agent every other time you want to see a place.
This way, you will end up working with someone who constantly has your needs in mind, you are likely to develop a professional relationship that will target and meet your goals in finding a home, and you won't waste a variety of agents time in the process.
People sometimes think that if they remain a "free agent" in other words committed to work with no agent, that they have the most flexibility. But you won't have the best service, your search for a home will not be optimized, and you will encounter agents who don't want to spend much time with you because they sense that they might be wasting their time.
This way, you will end up working with someone who constantly has your needs in mind, you are likely to develop a professional relationship that will target and meet your goals in finding a home, and you won't waste a variety of agents time in the process.
People sometimes think that if they remain a "free agent" in other words committed to work with no agent, that they have the most flexibility. But you won't have the best service, your search for a home will not be optimized, and you will encounter agents who don't want to spend much time with you because they sense that they might be wasting their time.
Two Agents? proper protocol?
About a month ago I spent a day looking at property with an agent. This agent had been sending me listings via email for a few weeks prior. Then a few days later, after doing research on the re-max web site, I saw a property that from the photos I thought I might really like. The "listing" agents' number ( a DIFFERENT person) was on the page so I called them and they sent me info on the property.
Now I'm confused on what to do. Do I ethically "owe" the first agent anything? I did not sign an exclusivity agreement. The two agents are not in exactly the same are, but they do show properties in the same area. I want to do the right thing, but if I called the "listing" agent of a property I like, why should I call the first agent and get another person involved for the sake of etiquette.
I dont really know what is considered "fair" in realestate. I want to do the right thing here, but what's the sense of bringing in another agent? Won't this end up simply inflating the price of the property? (two agents now need to get paid). Also it's not like I have a personal relationship with the first realtor.
However, the first agent drove around with me for a day...
What's the right thing to do here?
Thanks!
Jerry
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