Unprofessional Agents Ruining Home Buying Process

Profile picture for Danni M

Although this is technically a buyers market, it has been a crazy process for us... Between all the short sales that take months and then don't go through, REOs having copper piping stolen out of it while the banks take their sweet time reviewing the offers, it has been pretty frustrating.

In the mean time, some of the completely unprofessional agents like the REO outfit Patterson Properties are not making this situation any better.  We put an offer in on an REO.  Our offer was lower than the listing price, but this house was on the market for many months so we figured we would give it a shot.  The listing agent Jesse Yepez-Patterson of Patterson Properties shoots us a 1 line email saying he got our offer.  Then we wait.  Nothing.  My agent emails him, calls him, to no avail.  He never responds.  I finallly get so frustrated that I call him directly myself.  He answers the phone and tells me he has no information because his contact at the bank has been out of town.  Then he tells me he really is not supposed to talk to me directly, since I am represented by an agent ( ummm, yea, ok, so call my agent! ) .   Two days after my conversation with him took place, the house shows up in the MLS as PENDING!!

I just don't understand why someone would be so unprofessional in this situation?  What possible benefit does it have for Patterson to just not tell us he has another offer or whatever?  Why leave us hanging, and directly lie to me on the phone?  Anyway, for us that was our 5th offer and we have been at this for a year.  (Largely because our first offer was on a short sale that took 7 months and then bank foreclosed after all that!!)  I find this behaviour just very unacceptable.  I suppose there is no law that prevents an agent from being a jerk, but is there any like Real Estate BBB or something I can report this guy to?

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March 28 2009 - Sacramento

Replies (59)

The Seller's Agent does not represent you.  The Seller's Agent's job is to get the best deal possible for his client, not to make sure that they communicate effectively too you. 

If you didn't like the timing of it all, you should have had your Agent get a little more aggressive and get in contact with the Seller's Agent.  Its interesting that you say the Seller's Agent didn't call your Agent back, but you were able to get in contact with the Seller's Agent quickly youself.  Maybe its your Agent who has the communication problem.
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March 28 2009
Profile picture for Earl Boyer
Everyone shopping for foreclosures, REO's Short sales etc. should understand that there are a lot of headaches involved. The lender's departments that handle distressed properties are overwhelmed. Many of the listing agents may not fully understand the lender's requirements for submitting an offer. The same is true for buyer's agents. When an offer is submitted there is a review process. Many times a second lien holder is involved. Foreclosures do get vandalized both by people breaking in and the home owners in some cases. Offers, even ridiculous ones, have to be submitted; adding to the paperwork burden for the lenders.

Prices have fallen substantially in most areas. If you expect to get a home at an even deeper discount be prepared for the work and frustration.    
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March 28 2009
Profile picture for Danni M
@CHUTTA - I realize the selling agent does not represent me.  I have been working with my agent for a year and I am confident that both emailed and called the agent several times.  I got a hold of him only because I was so frustrated that I called the number listed about 5 times in appx 3 hours (I never left a message, just called) until finally he picked up the phone.  At that point, he directly lied to me.  He told me there was no information regarding the property and that his bank contact was out of town. 

I have no problems with the selling agent trying to get the best possible price for the seller (the bank in this case.) However, wouldn't he be doing best for the bank by submitting all the offers and giving them a chance to counter?  If he already had a offer in the works, then fine, just tell us that and don't waste our time and lie to us about it.

@Earl - I am aware of the headaches.  I dealt with a Countrywide short sale for 7 months only to watch it not go through in the end.  However, this does not address the fact that agents need to have a little professional curtosy.  In the countrywide deal, the listing agent called us and gave us updates every two weeks, even if she didn't have anything new.  But this time this Patterson agent directly lied, and probably never even submitted our offer to the bank.  This unprofessional behavior is what makes the headache a migrane!!!  
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March 28 2009
Profile picture for dchiarello
Sorry you've had such a difficult time.  Lack of communication is inexcusable.  One assumption you should make with a short sale is that there are other offers.  The lender wants to get as much as possible for the property, so they typically will accummulate offers, especially if the offers coming in are low.  It's a crazy situation - you'd think the lender would be anxious to close the file and get the darn property sold.  Unfortunately, each mitigator has so many properties they are handling, including foreclosures, it is impossible to be efficient.  My son is a loss mitigator - he works all kinds of hours and has mountains of paper to sift through.  The mitigator may have called the very day you saw the pending contract, and told the listing agent which offer to work.  Short sales are challenging for all parties.  As I tell my clients, when you are bidding on short sales, you must be patient - really, really patient!
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March 28 2009
However, wouldn't he be doing best for the bank by submitting all the offers and giving them a chance to counter? 

You don't know that your offer wasn't submitted.  You are assuming it wasn't submitted, because you didn't get a response, but by your own admission the offer was under list price.  There are many different scenarios in which I can imagine not responding to you...

One Scenario:  Your offer was far from what Seller wanted, but before countering or rejecting your offers, Seller wanted to see what kind of deal they could strike on other offer.

If he already had a offer in the works, then fine, just tell us that and don't waste our time and lie to us about it.

Actually this pertains to your previous post.  Seller's Agent doesn't represent you, this might be blunt, but as a Seller's Agent "wasting your time" is not a consideration.  As mentioned previously the Agent probably had no response for you until he/she knew what was going on with the First Offer.  No sense telling you they have an outstanding offer on the table (or already made a counter offer), because if they can't strike a deal with first offer and they come back to you, there is some loss in the negotiation.
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March 28 2009
Profile picture for Danni M
@CHUTTA - Well, even though I don't particularly agree with your point of view, I do appreciate that you seem to be the only person that actually read my post before responding, so you get a thumbs up for that.  :) :)

Anyway, I am cooled down a bit now as I posted this just after I saw that REO listed as Pending and was pretty upset... But regardless of all of your points, I feel like there needs to be some type of professional standard - it just gives the entire industry a bad name when agents are non-communicative or blatatly lie.  Agents do this every day but this is our first time buying a house so it is hugely stressful and not getting feedback to understand where we stand is very frustrating.  But whatever, off to find house #6 to put an offer on! 
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March 28 2009
I can understand the frustration.  Especially your first experience, but based on your comments I would put the blame of this frustration on your Agent.

I feel like there needs to be some type of professional standard - it just gives the entire industry a bad name when agents are non-communicative or blatatly lie. 

There's a difference between not telling you there is another offer and lieing.  You mentioned earlier you only got in touch with the Agent because you called 5 times in 3 hours.  Why didn't your Agent do this?  I cannot imagine one of my clients calling the Seller's Agent.  I really put this frustration on your Agent.  Your Agent should have sat down with you, explained to you everything that is and could be happening, then go and get in contact with Seller's Agent.  The fact that you got ahold of the Seller's Agent only proves that your Agent was not trying hard enough.
 
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March 28 2009
Profile picture for Alan Grizzle

As a buyers agent I have submitted offers on foreclosures, called the agent and left a voice mail telling them I sent it. I get no reply and call day after day after day. Get no call back, no thank you for the offer, never a word only to have a counter offer emaild to me. They never even bother to call to let me know it has been sent. Getting them on the phone is like winning the lottery. Given time and so many attempts someone will get lucky  but most will not.
This is most often the same agents that have no legal description on there listings no information on the property. They give us all a black eye. G

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March 28 2009
Profile picture for askmaryann

I hear ya Alan! And I don't think its fair to put the blame on the buyers agent here, we don't know if he/she made several attempts. And I'm sure they probly did try to contact the listing agent numerous times, if they went through the trouble of submitting the offer...I'm sure they would like to know if they'e going to make a sale. There are some unethical agents out there and its sad. Since all these foreclsoures hit the market, things have changed in the way some do business. After you work the REO's for a while you learn which agents are good and which are not. I could vent for awhile...but I won't. I wish Danni luck on number 6, I know its frustrating. I had 1 client that it took 8 offers.

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March 28 2009
Profile picture for Danni M
There's a difference between not telling you there is another offer and lieing.
I agree.  But when I called him and asked him the status of the property he said "I have no information on that property because my contact from the bank has been out of town." That is a blatant lie.   I left the conversation thinking I had put a little more pressure on him to be more communicative with my agent, and that maybe we had a chance in getting somewhere.  But I was obviously wrong!!!  At least I have my answer now and can move on to the next one!!!!

I cannot imagine one of my clients calling the Seller's Agent.
I suppose my agent could have done more to get in contact with this guy, but I think he just thought if he has multiple emails and messages out there already, this guy was just not going to respond. He may not be as aggressive as I am, but I have known him for a long time and I trust him. My agent has been an agent and broker in this area for over 10 years and has many repeat customers. I frankly think he was lost as to why this guy would be so non-responsive. In his view he expected at least a counter if there was another better offer.

Also understand that I have a pretty hands-on personality and I like to be involved. When it first appeared that he was going to be non-responsive, I looked this selling agent up on the DRE to make sure he was legit or to see if he had complaints or issues in the past - which cracked my agent up (the selling agent was clean).  I am sure I drive my agent crazy.  If I could be my own agent I probably would.  Once I finish my PHD I might just get my license on the side so I can do all of this myself the next time around. :) 
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March 28 2009
Profile picture for Danni M
@Alan and Maryann - Thanks!  Good to know I'm not the only buyer that has seen an agent like this... And I don't blame my agent at all, he is totally cool and I think he did what he was supposed to do here... Just not much you can do when the selling agent behaves this way!!  He has helped us a lot and we have learned a lot in this past year...  
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March 28 2009
I am not taking up for this agent as I do not know them or their company BUT what I do know is this.................
Dealing with REO's I know firsthand that the banks do drag their feet.
The REO agents I have worked with have submitted all offers. What is not known and/or understood by both buyers and agents even REO's have investors that are involved. The investors have to sign off the purchase contract and agree to all terms.
I have had REO's that went very smoothly from beginning to end.
I had an REO where offer was submitted in July, we did not receive written confirmation until late august and/or september and due to the difficulty in getting written instructions back the REO did not close until end of October.
It is frustrating but where there are investors involved like most of the Countrywide loans on short sales the wait is long and tedious.

It is unfortunate you have had this experience. Hopefully your next bid will prove to be positive.

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March 28 2009
Profile picture for Danni M
I apologize that I am so overly verbose.  I apologize that I mentioned a few things in my post that were not directly related to the main content of my post.  I value peoples opinions on this subject which is why I posted.  Please refer to the middle paragraph of my post and ignore the rest, I wish I could edit it but it is to late. 

- In this post, I am NOT taking issue with the various complications involved in short sale and/or REO process.
- In this post, I have NO issue with the time frames involved.

This post is related to what I feel is unprofessional behavior of listing agents; particularly with a non-responsive REO agent I just dealt with.  This post was airing my frustration and trying to understand what motives an REO agent would have for behaving this way.  Regardless of how long the bank takes, I believe a professional listing agent is responsible for giving the buyer's agent feedback on the submitted offer.   Thanks!
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March 29 2009
Yes you are 100 % correct in that the listing agent does have an obligation to communicate with the buyers agent.

If this listing agent is not returning calls then a call should go into their office manager. If that does not work to the local board.

Sadly there are those agents who feel the world revolves around them and them only. They forget that their job is to serve their clients and by serving the clients means keeping communication open to the buyers interested in that clients property.

Another possible avenue of complaint is to find out who actually is servicing the Bank . The listing agent is responsible either the bank and/or asset company manager.
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March 30 2009
Profile picture for TiffanyBond
It's a shame you only get to pick your agent and not the seller's agent too...life would be much easier that way. I can think of a few I would have removed were it my perogative.
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March 30 2009
Profile picture for girouard property RE
The listing agent is over whelmed...doesn't know what the heck he's doing.
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March 31 2009
Profile picture for girouard property RE
 BTW... I have an offer on a forclosed home in the SF Bay area...the offer was submitted this morning...we got a counter 2 hours later. The Banks don't drag their feet...the Realtors are worn thin if they don't know what they are doing...I'll let you know what happens
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March 31 2009
Profile picture for Pat Bourgo
This is a frustrating market we are in for the buyers looking for a great deal.
I'll give you a hint most REO Brokers don't care about anything but getting the bank what the bank wants.  I have gotten verbal approvals with in 12 hours.  The bank managers don't leave.  When you hear this it is bulls***. Another good one is Bank personnel is out of town until (usually 3-7 days).  They are trying to get multiple offers.  Usually they will put the listing in on Thursday night and say they are presenting offers Monday mourning.  Monday turns into Tuesday's phone call that they will be responding either tomorrow or Thursday.  This give them a week to get multiple offers.  Then when they get multiple offers the counter everybody with highest and best offer.  This buys them another 2-3 days.

If you don't get a yes with in a day, your getting played.  Rescind your offer and get the bank back. This will back fire on the listing broker.  Make sure your contact information is on the offer.  If they want to sell it bad enough they will contact you or your agent.
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March 31 2009
Profile picture for NLindler
unfortunately, that is the tide of the market. REO agents take first direction from the bank and always consider highest and best offers. It is frustrating, and most of these agents are too overwhelmed to care to return phone calls. Best bet sometimes is having your agent get in touch with their assistants to get the full story on offer status
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April 13 2009
I lost six bids before I finally nailed an REO at $115K.

From what I understand there are currently over 600,000 REOs waiting in the wings.

They are farming these REOs out in bulk to REAs under contract who have geared up with cheap imbeciles to process them.

Next year will be even more interesting-- there are trillions of dollars more to be foreclosed.

Laugh it off and move on. Persist and a better deal is around the corner. Remember you are in charge -- do not pay over 1995 pricing or you will be underwater next year.
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April 13 2009
BTW, they often send out a "Best and Final" offer letter to the REO bidders.

I just check the "Decline to re-bid box" and fax it back with a big F/U scrawled across it.

Never rebid -- that is their game. Remember: time is on our side and it is time to stick these squeeling greed-pigs nuzzling up to the tax-payer's trough. God! I have nothing but sheer contempt for our so-called financial titans!!!! I'd love to do water-sports on their bloated dissipated faces!
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April 13 2009
Profile picture for titan10
I personally think that the sellers agent is looking to double end the deal. This happened a lot to me, and it seemed all the good deals, the agent was non existent. I started talking to the listing agent to show me the houses, and suddenly they had all the time in the world for me because they thought they were getting both sides.
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April 13 2009
Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE
Way to tell it like it is, Chaz!  LOL.

First of all, one agent stated that a listing agent MUST communicate with the buyer's agent.  Not in my area.  Most REO listings in my area state that the agent will only forward ONE offer to the bank - and that is usually the best offer.  Granted, they SHOULD communicate with all the agents, but they are frequently playing a game, to manipulate that best offer in front of the bank's eyes.

There is also another phenomenon that happens in every market I have seen like this in the past 32+ years.  There is always a percentage of these REO agents who are greedy, and who are delaying other offers hoping to get a better one themselves. ( It is VERY easy to get your buyer to submit the best offer when you know what the other offers are.)

As Chaz advised, keep trying, and with luck, a better property, and a better listing agent will materialize.
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April 13 2009
Profile picture for ArnoldCountry
Its an interesting game out there... today, buyers are gold, yet, banks and some seller's agents play games with buyers in a feeble attempt to manipulate you.  As a buyer, you need to be gutsy and aggressive.  Dont play their way, the key is making multiple offers on several properties and having language in your purchase contract that advising them you are making multiple offers and the first one to get accepted wins.  Have definate termination dates in your offer and stick to your guns.  If they come back after your time is up, tell them no thanks, you are interested in something else.  If you play their game and let them get away with it... you learn that your gold is fools gold.  Look at the success of Chaz... multiple offers.  Lenders have been playing the public like puppets.  Contrary to what you may hear, BUYERS ARE TRULY GOLD, start acting like it. Don't do business with agents like this post described.  I do feel uncomfortable twith the posting of someone's name on here but the fact circumstances are worthy of speaking with your feet... walk from that type of agent.
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April 13 2009
Profile picture for girouard property RE
Wow nvchaz, you've got posters/realtors liking your comments? yikes...Your image is getting tarnished..
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April 22 2009
Profile picture for realtorozzy
Well I stopped reading somewhere around the middle.

I'm also an agent, and if some of us are not willing to admit it, the issue is simple POOR handling of the situtation by a REALTOR.. 

Sure we can say the banks are slow, even thought the issue at hand had nothing to do with speed.

I come from a service background, you have to be responsive, follow up, TRUTHFULL, there is a hard one for many, take responsibility, I've made mistakes, and in some cases they have cost me money, rarely the customer because I took ownership of the problem, and tried everything within my powers to correct the problem.

I wonder what would happen if clients new how easy it is to place a complaint against a Realtor, and how serious those complaints are looked at.

Bottom line, I was not there, so I can't take sides, but too many  Realtors specially those that are fortunate enought to have the banks give them much more than they can obvioulsy handle drop the ball.

 
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April 22 2009
Hi Phyllis,

Yes, most of them have their blinders on... so concerned about past dichotomies they fail to see what a fluid and synergistic dynamic is real estate. Wow! It is pretty heady stuff and I love exploring it. Most of these posters are so cowered they've hidden behind stale defenses supported by whatever statistics and third party reports they can dredge up. They'll even reach out to Europe if the report supports what they say.

So, despite what the doomers say, these are fun times we are living in. I'm new to real estate but I bought a lot of books, (No, not "Rich Dad, Poor Dad") and I'm studying like mad. These are the times I thrive in... others weep and moan and bury their head in the sand.

As soon as I get this current deal done, I'm going after another one. In Chaos Is Opportunity!
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April 22 2009
"Wow nvchaz, you've got posters/realtors liking your comments? yikes...Your image is getting tarnished.. "
Don't you really know, many poeples like Nvchaz, even some of Nvchaz haters turn to like him also, at least they like to respond to him.
One of the reason is : "he is straight shooter."
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April 22 2009
"In Chaos Is Opportunity! " translate to english is "Take the beautiful girl and leave the ugly for the other".
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April 22 2009
Classic, Hoang, I love it. But I might annotate:

Should it not be: ""Take the more beautiful girl and leave the uglier for the other".

After all. we have to be realistic about our expectations.
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April 22 2009
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