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Va Loan Over FHA Conforming Limit

In Orange County, CA the VA limit is $737,500, the FHA Limit is $625,500.  Would an amount higher than the FHA Limit considered Jumbo?  Are the rates ~ 2% higher than conforming?
  • February 21 2009 - Laguna Hills
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Answers (119)

I'll try and stay on subject this time.

"I have personally checked the VA site and OC is $737,500, and as far as I can tell, the VA guarantees 25% of the value of loans up to this amount, eliminating PMI.  It sounds to me like a VA loan in OC for this amount will not trigger Jumbo rates, so that is good also. "

Correct. The maximum guaranty amount is 25 percent of the 2009 VA Limit. With full entitlement available you may borrow up to the 2009 VA Limit and VA will guarantee 25 percent of the loan amount.

"It would seem to me that LTV limits should not apply since VA is guarantying 25% up to the limit - Is that correct?"

Yes.

Someone asked, what I'm looking for:  I'm targeting up to $800k.


If you purchased an $800,000 home in OC, and we use Bob's upcpming limits since you say you are in no hurry, then wit the limit of $729,750 with full entitlement you would only need $17,562.50 Down Payment.

How much equity can I take out of my current property to assist with down payment?

I do not believe there is the same LTV restriction that Fannie has to be able to use the rental income towards qualifying but I am not sure so I cannot say how much you can safely take out. (Anyone?)
  • February 24 2009
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Ps, you don't have to pay 5.25% or 5.375%. If you are a long termer, I would suggest using some of the extra cash you thought you had to put down, to buy the rate down. And now the obligatory message: Place a loan request here on Zillow and specify that you are looking for a VA loan so at least the people that still read quotes can respond.  I can guarantee you won't get many quotes however because the auto-spammers won't pick up the loan amount or price it correctly.
  • February 24 2009
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Bob P,

Splitting hairs?

You quoted "5.75" with 0 points.  It actually had 1.5 discount.  That is a HUGE difference...  On you $3,000,000 that is $45,000 in points.  Even on $1,000,000, that is $15,000.

May be available April 1 versus "Presently available" is a huge difference!!!!

You say you were giving advice.........sounds like advice to me.  The hold gets deeper and deeper.
  • February 24 2009
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Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE
Bob L, you've gone back off topic. Here's the thing. I never mentioned "points" until I posted that my lender told me - yesterday - that it would take 1.5 points for the 5.75%, 30 year fixed rate, I originally suggested. 

MY intended point was to clarify to the original inquirer that - in my humble opinion - jumbo rates were no longer 2% higher than conforming rates. 

To Brian, thank you for the extremely clear answer regarding the VA process.  Too bad the original inquiry wasn't quite as elaborate or thorough as his later post.  You probably would have jumped in 3 pages ago and saved 3 pages of Internet trees.
  • February 24 2009
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Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE

By the way, my lender friends,  DLF4, the original poster here also made a post on Jan. 30th, asking how to Maximize his purchasing power.  THAT post was extremely thorough, similar to his second post in this thread. ( As opposed to the vague, 3 sentence inquiry that started this thread.)

That inquiry was WAY over my head, and definitely a question for an experienced lender - like Brian.  I wouldn't have ( And didn't.) touched that inquiry with a ten foot pole.

I've already given my reason for jumping in on this thread.  Actually, first or second post, before Gregorio jumped down my throat, with his hysterics.

  • February 24 2009
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Profile picture for Clearpoint
  • February 24 2009
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i never read the mortgage boards. gives me a headache. i followed agt bob here and laughed my a$$ off.typical self rightuos used house salesman. priceless!
  • February 24 2009
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That is the whole point Bob P.  Your replies typically only handle part of the prior post.  You never addressed the "presently available" versus "by April 1". 

I am simply pointing out how you dig the hole deeper and deeper.  Your original post was incorrect and your responses after that were incorrect.

If we posted a rate on here and did not disclose points, we would be scrutinized and put through the ringer.  You say this is not advice, when it clearly is.

And, you think its okay to put in contracts because the product will be expedited quickly.

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong!!!!

I was trying to be nice, but can see why Gregorio and Greg lost their patience and reacted like they did.  To keep fighting this argument, is idiotic on your behalf.
  • February 24 2009
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Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE
To my lender friends, since our "discussion" a day or two ago, I have learned something interesting.

Apparently Zillow, in their wisdom, lumps articles/threads that they deem as related, into subcategories.  For me, this thread began in the "Orange County, CA, Advice" heading, which is the one I usually plug in when I log onto Zillow.

Evidently, it soon segued into the "Mortgage" category, without my knowing.  I found it curious that no other Realtors joined into our party, and that is why.

I personally wouldn't even think to look in the Mortgage tab - nor would many of my peers.  For you lenders who objected to my participating in YOUR category, consider the above, and blame Zillow, not me.

For all you might think of me, or my fellow agents, try to bear in mind that, in many respects, we are on the same team, and occasionally actually have to work together.  Have a great year!
  • February 24 2009
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Wow!
Most apparently, the agent from California is a persistent one a truly is stuck on stupid.
"Let it Be. Let it be.  Let it be, oh yeah, let it be.  Whisper words of wisdom, let it be."  Great song full of meaning.  You remember that song, don't you?
  • February 24 2009
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Bob agent,

We welcome input from realtors...based on the Non Advice you gave...It might save us mortgage folks some headaches if you spent a little more time reading some of the mortgage threads so when you are talking with clients you may actually be able to pass along accurate info...

  • February 24 2009
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Profile picture for bvkiran
   What is written law is not enacted law. It took 3 months for it to take effect since Bush signed in Feb 08. But it took few seconds in dec 08 for lenders to stop it diligently.

   Obama can sign all the papers he can, nothing will get implemented anytime soon. Too little too late. I suspect June is the time lenders will even offer it.
By that time we will all be in depression and zillow might also be bankrupt.
  • March 01 2009
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Profile picture for Peter G. Miller
Hi --
It used to be that loan limits were very clear and good for a year, however they are now locally-based and for both 2008 and 2009 have changed twice.

I have posted an updated set of mortgage loan limits for conventional, FHA and VA borrowers at

http://www.ourbroker.com/?p=2430


All the best,

Peter G. Miller
Syndicated Columnist
  • March 04 2009
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Guam over $1M loan amt and $2M on a 4Plex, on an FHA Loan? Guam? I cant get over $346K in Buckhead where the avg sales price is $800k plus. Guam?   

Here are a couple of suggestions for your next articles:

1)When refinancing FHA to FHA and the payoff goes to the 2nd or 3rd of the next month, a whole months interest is added to the payoff. Who keeps that money, the lender or is it paid to FHA? That is something the blowhards in congress could fix.
2) Lenders, OR BANKS, who point out that they do not charge an origination fee, but their quote includes 1 discount point instead, and the rate is a " par " rate. In other words, even though they are charging a discount point, which most people think is used to " buy the rate down ", the rate is not actually being bought down so it must convert to an origination point which is what they claim they dont charge.
  • March 04 2009
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Profile picture for Brian Brady
Right now jumbo loans are those over $729,500.  This, in Orange County Calif. is absolutely true - verified by HUDs website and that of the White House.  The lenders may NOT have quite worked out the details, but I'm willing to wager that it won't take more than 20-30 days from now.

It appears that Mr. Phillips isn't so "misleading" after all. His prognostication of 20 days turned out to be "padded" by a week or two.  The higher loan limits were accepted by many of my lenders and investors three days ago; a week earlier than he predicted.
  • March 06 2009
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At Well's, FHA has been in tack for two days.....nothing on conventional......

Again, right now does not mean sometime soon....
  • March 06 2009
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Brian, do you know of other lenders offering the 2008 limits on conventional loans today?
  • March 06 2009
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Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE
Thanks for the heads up, Brian. 

I'll try not to jump the gun next time.  I'm still learning my way around Zillow.  Doing much better on subsequent threads.
  • March 06 2009
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Profile picture for byoung74
How do we find out if this is available in other counties?
  • March 21 2009
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Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE
Wow!  Has it been 4 weeks since the question was asked?  Time sure flies. Here was part of the question:  In Orange County, CA the VA limit is $737,500, the FHA Limit is $625,500.

Since that day, the FHA and conventional limits for Orange County, CA, are NOW up to $729,750., and the VA upper limit is now $1,500,000.
( With 25% down.)

A veteran borrower, in Orange County, CA, can now get a loan of up to $1,070,000., with NO money down. ( rolling the 2.15% funding fee into the loan for a total VA loan of $1,094,000.)

This is sensational news.
  • March 21 2009
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"A veteran borrower, in Orange County, CA, can now get a loan of up to $1,070,000., with NO money down."

Bob, VA will only guarantee 25% of county "high balance" limit.    So, if its over the county limit, they will have to put money down.

$1,070,000 is over the limit, so they would have to put money down. 

  • March 21 2009
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Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE
You may be correct, Bob L. - however, I am looking at a published sheet from my lender, Kevin Budde, which reads: " 2009 VA loan limits Have been increased.  $1,094,000. maximum 100% LTV, $1,500,000. maximum loan with 25% down payment."

Since he's been my lender for many years, AND has over 34 years of Orange County VA/FHA experience, I tend to take him at his word. Of course, even he could be wrong, but that hasn't happened yet, in our relationship.

  • March 21 2009
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VA Website Examples

Here is the VA website...  take a look at example #7
  • March 21 2009
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Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE
OK, Bob L.,  I looked.  Here's what I read: "Due to variations in the amount of entitlement available to an individual veteran, loan limits for individual counties, and purchase prices for homes, situations may arise which are not covered here. Lenders are encouraged to contact the appropriate VA Regional Loan Center prior to closing a loan if there are questions about the VA guaranty calculation."

My conclusion?  Perhaps there is something within that paragraph that either you, or my lender friend is misinterpreting.  The link you gave me was a "examples" under certain circumstances.  Perhaps the circumstances are different for Orange County, OR for my lender.

In any event, since I don't presently have a VA buyer looking for a $1mm loan, I think I'll just take my lender's word that he has such financing available, OK?
  • March 21 2009
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I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure VA is VA is VA. No lenders have different program guidelines in regards to acceptable loan amounts. True?
In any event, Bob the Realtor, your post is an advertisement and nothing more. I will flag it as such, and I hope others do the same.


  • March 21 2009
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Profile picture for Big Johnnie

Bob Phillips, does Kevin Budde make you keep the moustache because he likes the way it feels while you are kissing his ass. Why don't you please shut up about him and if he wants to help out with information, he can come here himself and share his knowledge instead of you trying to decipher lending quidelines and badly bothcing them

I have painfully read through this entire thread and have to say you have no clue what you are talking about and that being said, stop trying to help people with lending advice. Stick to buying/selling boards and telling everyone how its a great time to buy property in a state that is heading for insolvency.

{comment removed by moderater for severe insults towards Bob Phillips even though moderator feels they are completely warranted}


  • March 21 2009
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Profile picture for BobPhillipsRE
Well, Jennifer, if that's how you feel, that's your prerogative.  I've never considered a recommendation of someone I have a mutually successful relationship with as an advertisement - unless I was being paid referral fees by that person - which I am not.

So, advertisement, or endorsement, he's still my favorite lender.

The "blurb" that Bob L. linked to was not a set of state by state guidelines, just a few examples out of probably hundreds of possibilities.
  • March 21 2009
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Bob P, there are no "state" guidelines, except for loan limits.

Jennifer, was right.  VA is VA.
  • March 21 2009
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Profile picture for Bozo the clown
My Goodness, it took a half hour to read this thread. Bob, tell us one more time who your favorite lender is! By the way, I'm bringing back the SHOW! and I'd like to invite you all for the very first PIE THROWING CONTEST. (Jen, you can be my assistant). Big Johnnie, didn't I have you on the show when you were 5? Dude---you got so old!
  • March 21 2009
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